Production Process and Codes On ST Bolt On Models

[Sigmania]

In an effort to try and sort out what some of the remaining mysteries are with:

- the second number in the production code,
- why some serial numbers are out of sequence relative to pot dates and month codes,
- etc.

I decided to try to guess at what the likely sequence is for putting together an ST guitar for Tokai hoping that might give us some clues through looking at what happens when and what needed to then be coordinated, possibly through a system of production codes.

Tokai Neck and Body Codes

 

[Sigmania]

The sequence might look something like this:



Production process:


Receive order

Wood for order

CNC Cut bodies and necks

Fretboards applied

Bodies mated with necks* ?

Production & color codes stamped * ?

Paint and finish coat neck & body

Install electronics in body

Install frets on neck

Decal on headstock

Bolt together neck & body with neck plate/serial number" ?

Set up

Shipped out

 

[Sigmania]

Hard not to notice the different stacks, and wonder how they kept things organized.

I am seeing a 9 at the top of this stack from the 1981 catalog.

1981 Flat Top Series Catalog Hi Res Images

 

[Sigmania]

Factory tour in 2013 by 'drowning in guitars".

A Day in Hamamatsu…

Looks like I am seeing a stack of guitars marked 2.8 among other things in this 2013 photo.








Note that a few of these apparently un-mated necks already have stamps on them.... No frets yet. Possibly pulled out of production sequence for QC issues?






Here is one that has an obvious marker line through an old code...

 

[Sigmania]

And here on this special order.

2 - 9

宮地楽器 神田店

 

[Sigmania]

And surely there is a clue as to what the second number means when you have two guitars like these examples that have two numbers that notably are both in sequence. Both coincidentally are number 3 & 4 even though these guitars were made 2 years apart.


My 1979 ST100GS



And a 1981 ST60YS
Tokai Springy Sound ID help please

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

[Welcome to the speculation theme park]

That could suggest that the entire code refers to specific orders, which begins with wood slab/blank selection for each order (that's why they end up on the slabs right from the start, before they go to the CNC routers). The order number consists initially of "month=order # of that month".

My uneducated guess is that distributor X orders let's say nnn LS-60, nn LS-200 and nn ST-50, that's 3 different wood selections for the same order, that goes into separate stacks/locations for each model and grade carrying the 'nn=nn' code. A big pin board carries the order sheet which lists how many of each color were ordered, and specifies that distributor X wants nn of the ST-50s to have a V-neck. The V-necks get a letter code for identification and the body blanks get their color code before they go into the paint shop.

Likewise, domestic store chain Y (or I) orders nnn LS-50 but with a cool flame veneer top or in a special color and negotiated a special price, so some of the lower quality wood slabs get selected for that order and letter codes for the specification, and (super-mega-speculative rollercoaster looping!) since it's a recurring large volume customer, they have their own serial number scheme.

[Thank you for visiting Speculationland, please come again!]

This is based on some random factory tour YT videos I watched with one eye and one ear and the assumption that basically most output of a guitar factory is based on specific orders. Few (if any) would stock big piles of guitars in a warehouse waiting for potential customers, except for an amount and model selection that is very predicable in demand. These guitars could then follow the same production code scheme as an "in-house order", maybe with a special location in the wood store that differentiates them from other orders.

 

[Sigmania]

I had been thinking the same thing, that the second number relates to orders or batches, but didn’t want to preclude/bias the observations of others.

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

I don't want that either so please delete or forget, I'd be curious what interpretations other people would have as well.

The challenge is to find out what guitars with an e.g. 'X' in the code had in common when they left the factory 40 years ago. But seriously, they really could be a little less secretive with things that don't necessarily reveal any secrets anyway. If letters refer to specific customers and other letters to features, they could leave out the customer letters or at least confirm the general scheme so we can put that to rest.

 

[Sigmania]

The problem with the job order theory in my mind are those two examples that have stamps with two second numbers, in sequence. Job orders wouldn’t be like that I wouldn’t think. But batches of wood, or of batches in a production line, or time might be? Seems to be something that is sequential.

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

I imagine errors could happen, orders could be amended or canceled and the material rededicated? Or orders from the same customer could be split into different batches intended for different stores, so its 2 numbers for what's actually the same order?

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

BTW...

Production process:
[...]
Fretboards applied
[...]
Install frets on neck

When the fretboards are glued on and frets installed can vary a lot. Gibson frets the bare fretboards after doing the inlays and applies the binding to the fretboard before that all gets glued onto the neck. Fender is fretting the neck blanks somewhere in the middle of the shaping process, after inlay work and radius sanding.

 

[Sigmania]

BTW...



When the fretboards are glued on and frets installed can vary a lot. Gibson frets the bare fretboards after doing the inlays and applies the binding to the fretboard before that all gets glued onto the neck. Fender is fretting the neck blanks somewhere in the middle of the shaping process, after inlay work and radius sanding.

The pics of the factory show fretboards on ST necks and no frets.

I was trying to be specific to Tokai ST guitars to try and sort out the two issues raised in the OP.

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

TBH it's really hard to see on the pics but it looks to me like most of the necks in that rack have no frets (yet), except a few obvious ones on the left side. This is all rather hard to figure out without seeing the context. A very simple explanation would be that the rack gets filled with necks to be fretted and the fretted necks get put back into the same rack. Often the racks have wheels but this one looks more like storage.

I tried to spot something in the videos but there are only a few and they all don't show the F-style guitar production for the most part.

 

[Sigmania]

Did you see the ones I pointed out that had codes stamped on them and were apparently put back in the rack?

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

Yeah I did, but I wouldn't know how to interpret that - they look very randomly put back into the rack. On the far left of the lowest shelf are a few that look like they have frets but are not stamped while the others look more unfretted but are stamped, but this is really hard to see.

 

[Sigmania]

1981 ST55OW

SN 1020828

Note the codes on this one.

Note that the neck and body codes have a different number in the second position. That seems to further suggest that number relates to something related to how it was made or lot.

Also note the "H' written on the neck. That seems to mean painted Headstock. Also note the color code (OW) is on the neck.

1981 Tokai Springy Sound ST55 *RARE w Matched Headstock MIJ Vintage Stratocaster | eBay

 

[Sigmania]

Here is another one with a matching headstock and the color code written on the neck and the letter H indicating painted headstock.

Matching Headstock Gallery

 

[ATO]

In support of the theory that the 2nd number possibly being an order number
I have a UK block logo springy Nov 82, 11=12 N
Someone has also recently posted a Nov 82 UK block logo springy 11=12 BB
Both 50/60 necks, one maple the other rosewood
Both guitars more than likely on the same import order.

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

(T)LS bodies with lot/order numbers?