Lawsuit?

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Wondering if the block logo was a quick fix in response to the seized guitars??

"... in so far as the defendants now wish to try to secure the release of those 205 guitars bearing that infringing mark "Strat", possibly on the basis of being able to delete the infringing mark, they must follow the procedure which is set out in the appropriate statute relating to the position"


Wonder if any were re-labeled?
 
Sigmania said:
Were there ever any actually legal actions by Gibson or Fender against Tokai in the late 70s/early 80s?

By Gibson possibly around the "Les Paul" name used in association with Tokai guitars, or by Fender a few years later re: use of the term "Strat", the headstock shape, the Spaghetti logo, or anything else?

I have read various things on here, but have not seen any documents along these lines.

Wondering what actually happened that led to obvious changes in the Les Paul/Les Paul Reborn/Love Rock name and the change in the Springy/Goldstar logo and headstock?

Question answered... 8)
 
"Gordon Bishop, instructed by Knapp-Fishers, appeared for the plaintiffs.
David Micklethwait, instructed by Ratner & Cave (Blackpool), appeared for the defendants."


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http://www.iporalhistory.co.uk/record/65
 
I guess the reason this was so hard to find is that it was a war waged through proxies.

CBS went after a distributor rather than TOKAI. David and Goliath.

Also, I’m left wondering why Arbiter got involved? Was Arbiter a Fender distributor? Was it because Arbiter had standing in the UK?

Would love to follow this further. Hopefully, some folks are still alive that were part of this battle.

Would love to hear from Eric Dixon. 8)
 
Yes, Arbiter at this time is not only the main dealer for fender CBS but the only dealer, Arbiter is not a shop it’s a brand so they themselves distributed in the uk so wax the perfect choice for CBS as at this time Arbiter are a big name and are delivering products to shops all over the uk, they would get the batches and then send out to shops to sell obviously making a profit in distribution. Arbiter dispatched all JV squier and fenders to uk shops so Arbiters interest is sales, if fender lose sales month by month then batches get smaller, smaller batches is les profit for Arbiter and CBS in the uk.

See “Arbiter fuzz face” this is why fender jumped on them and bought the “fuzz face” it’s how the relationship started. I can imagine a deal was struck immediately so fender could sell the fuzz face pedal 😉

Remember at this point there is no internet so you can’t just contact fender as a shop, shipping is basic and only big shipments are sent to the uk, there is no “fender dealers” or recently “fender direct” so as a result Arbiter collected the batches at the docks and distributed to uk shops.

This is why Arbiter was and is a part of CBS but not apart of fender directly as CBS is a group.

Like Volkswagen is the group but they sell a number of car makes, Bentley, Lamborghini and so on.

Tokai was a direct threat to Arbiter and CBS.

I think that I’m this time there is not a lot of commercial shops so Arbiter can’t say it’s directly hurting them but as a result is hurting a shop “blue suede music” that would mean a business not a brand or a group is hurt.

Put it this way. No one would care so much if the big guns like CBS or Arbiter lost profit so music shops or the biggest at the time would have to show they are directly hurt as their profit is only in customer sales not a group like CBS.

Boom Arbiter and CBS had ground to act immediately but we all know fender did this but fender couldn’t, CBS couldn’t but to prove damages Arbiter could with the help of shops in the uk selling direct to the customer.
 
I think to conclude.

CBS profit is probably effected by .00000001%
Arbiter profit probably.001
But music shops that stock fender could see a 20% drop in fender sales so you would need the shop to back Arbiter and CBS.

over the years people have concluded that in 1982 the JV was sent but don’t take account it’s probably only 10% Of the batch sent the rest sent would be fender USA made so again it’s not only japan made fender but the biggest hit is on the USA made, some people think in 1982 the batches are japan squier and fenders as the JV but it’s not it’s USA made too in larger numbers, let me stress, the JV was a budget guitar aimed at beginners and kids so it’s just a small % of the batch.
 
From the lawyers letter:

“The injunction which was made simply on Mr Arbiter's evidence…”

Mr Arbiter.
 
Like I’ve said for the past 10 years (I had to leave Facebook because of boneheads “hahaha no one went to coughs it’s a myth , prove it, prove it, prove it) the tokai springysound 1977 to 1982 is the lawsuit guitar hands down.

I think we've now nailed that and the proof is on the table.

I also know that this is the 1st time fender acted, yes Gibson acted on Ibanez but that was the “out of court settlement” so again not exactly a lawsuit guitar.

Can we all now agree that the “lawsuit guitar” is as a proven fact the “7okai” springy 1977 to 1982?

Can I get an amen?
 
Amen. I wasn’t going to say it. :lol:

And I wouldn’t have started digging if you hadn’t posted that article that mentioned some details I hadn’t seen before. So big thanks.

40 year old mystery here unraveling.

Some books and web sites may need to be re-written. :roll:
 
“Sigmania” check the 1986 tokai front cover of the catalog, the model is “nipping out”

“Tokai is coming” poster is quite famous now.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ykxonulf7yp5ves/Photo%2005-07-2022%2C%2022%2032%2059.jpg?dl=0
 
Yes I agree, I think many people have egg on their face right now.

Don’t worry, many people I bet have already screen shot or saved everything and the work will be now pushed by many people. I’m not on Facebook anymore but I wish I was 😉

Just great work and “Sigmania” I stopped at that article I posted so I think the credit goes to you here.

I just started the fire, you kept the fire going and turned it in to a fireworks display.

Bravo sir
 
I’ve been reading your posts for 2 full days.

I know you are not done 😉

Got to go, the wife just gave me “that look”
 
Dates not exactly accurate, but another piece of the puzzle.


WORLD DOMINATION AND LEGAL BACKLASH

Though the guitars were originally aimed at the domestic market, by the early '80s Tokai was exporting worldwide. In the UK, Blue Suede Music started importing Tokais in 1982 with their eye-catching Tokai is coming' ads featuring a naked girl cavorting with a Springy Sound (the model was the girlfriend of Blue Suede's owner).

By now, however, Fender and Gibson had woken up to their shrinking market share. Fender entered into a joint venture to establish Fender Japan in 1982, and launched their first serious reissues on the US market (the 1957 and 1962 Vintage Strats). Battalions of lawyers, and Tokai's own desire to enter the US market more fully led to more 'respectful' replicas: the LP-style Reborn became the Reborn Old, then the Love Rock; the pseudo- Fender logo changed (in the UK) to a black, block- capital TOKAI (1983) before moving worldwide to a gold lettered script that couldn't be mistaken for the famous Fender one.

In 1984 the Springy Sound became 'Goldstar Sound' and, for the US market, the Fender-style headstocks were reshaped to a less attractive and less litigious pointy shape. The 'lawsuit era' was over, and Fender and Gibson filled the market with increasingly faithful reproductions of their


http://www.tokairegistry.com/tokai-info/Andrew Munro Article-July2008.pdf
 
Dan, I just typed out all of the text in the article you shared so everyone can read it.

The clue I needed was the "CBS/Arbiter" part and the fact that the action was taken in the UK.

I had been looking in the US and in Japan.

Also note the date of the article re: the legal action. It was still ongoing when this was written.

Thanks again for posting that!

5kVVwZP.png


Melody Maker
July 10, 1982

Words: Paul Colbert
Pics: Lesley Sly

"FENDER - TURNING JAPANESE"

The iceberg turns in the flow and another face breaks surface... CBS/Arbiter's decision to mastermind Japanese-made models of classic Fender's puts another slant on their courtroom battle against Tokai.

Tokai it was who released a series of stunningly accurate copies at the the end of last year, well above average in price and quality.

CBS/Arbiter fought them on grounds of passing off, claiming the Tokai logo was shaped to look like Fender and lure customers.

Perhaps that litigation could now be viewed as a blockade tactic until Fender's own Japanese versions arrived with the vital difference that they have the word FENDER writ bold upon the headstock.

There are even rumors that when CBS/Arbiter were looking for a factory in Japan they approached Tokai to do the job, sending over the blueprints in the bargain. Truth or tattle, it might explain why CBS/Arbiter were irked enough to take the dock.

And now we have the Japanese Vintages, code named Squires, and including '57 and '62 Strats, a '52 Tele, '57 and '62 Precisions, and a '62 Jazz. And they are very, very good.

Was a time when you could buy a guitar that looked, played and sounded like a Strat... or you could buy a Strat. Now even that distinction is waving goodbye.

In truth Tokai are as detailed in their replicas but, psychological or not, having that Fender logo at the top of the headstock puts heritage in your hands even if given an eastern interpretation.

I can only say that though Tokai and Squire are well matched for sound and feel there was simply more excitement in playing Vintages and that's a quality impossible to measure on a ruler.
 
Timeline:

Note: Removing old versions to reduce space and confusion. Scan ahead for most recent version.
 
Fleshing out a timeline:

January 1982

Jan. 21, 1982. CBS/Arbiter sends letter titled "URGENT - PRESS RELEASE" giving notice to Tokai dealers in the UK of potential legal action, injunction.

Jan. 25, 1982. Blue Suede Music Ltd. consults Ratner & Cave attorneys as counsel and sends its own letter to Tokai dealers in the UK.

February 1982

Previously planned model changes and new Fender style serial number system set to take effect.

May 1982

Tokai guitars being imported seized and held by Customs including 205 guitars bearing the word "Strat".

CBS/Fender sought an injunction in the UK of the importation of Tokai guitars claiming Tokai was passing off guitars and is a copyright infringement.

June1982

Blue Suede Music Ltd. petitions court re: seizure, etc.

Judge rules that the use of the word Tokai could not be an infringement on Fender's rights.

"I held that the particular form of the word "Tokai", which was being used on the defendants' guitars, was not an infringement of the registered trade mark of the plaintiffs, "Fender". The plaintiffs, however, alleged infringement of other registered trade marks, of which one was "Strat". I dealt also in that judgment with the questions of infringement of copyright and passing off. What has happened is that, before I heard the motion the plaintiffs had served on the Commissioners of Customs & Excise certain notices in relation to guitars to be imported by the defendants..."


Ruling on guitars with the word "Strat" on them:

"In effect what the notice of motion asks is that I shall make a mandatory injunction against the plaintiffs to withdraw the notices which they have served. So far as concerns the notice in respect of the largest proportion, numberwise, of the guitars which have been seized by the Customs, namely, the so-called "Vintage Stratocaster", of which there are 205, I would not under any circumstances consider making the order asked for, because it is conceded that those carry the trade mark "Strat" and are infringements."

"... in so far as the defendants now wish to try to secure the release of those 205 guitars bearing that infringing mark "Strat", possibly on the basis of being able to delete the infringing mark, they must follow the procedure which is set out in the appropriate statute relating to the position"


July 1982

Melody Maker article on July 10, 1982 touting the new Squires available in the UK.

October 1982

Block logo guitars in shops in the UK
 
Man, if you could document that you owned one of those 205 seized spaghetti logo Springys... those would be the quintessential "lawsuit guitars". Blockade runners... 8)

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Illustration by Rick Griffin


FenderDan1 said:
Like I’ve said for the past 10 years (I had to leave Facebook because of boneheads “hahaha no one went to coughs it’s a myth , prove it, prove it, prove it) the tokai springysound 1977 to 1982 is the lawsuit guitar hands down.

I think we've now nailed that and the proof is on the table.

I also know that this is the 1st time fender acted, yes Gibson acted on Ibanez but that was the “out of court settlement” so again not exactly a lawsuit guitar.

Can we all now agree that the “lawsuit guitar” is as a proven fact the “7okai” springy 1977 to 1982?

Can I get an amen?


Sigmania said:
Wondering if the block logo was a quick fix in response to the Tokai guitars seized by Customs in the UK in June 1982??

"... in so far as the defendants now wish to try to secure the release of those 205 guitars bearing that infringing mark "Strat", possibly on the basis of being able to delete the infringing mark, they must follow the procedure which is set out in the appropriate statute relating to the position"

Wonder if any of the 205 seized guitars were re-labeled?

True "lawsuit guitars" ?

http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25979&p=199052#p199052

xoHG9f1.jpg


Ve1oTOR.jpg

http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=26253&p=199108#p199108
 
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