Drop in Tokai's standards

[Donkey Oaty]

Even if you are a Tokai fanatic who loves the brand Tokai, you must see the problem arising.

".....

Love is blind mate.


I am on your side. I like and respect Tokais, I also like and respect Gibson, Fender , PRS and most other brands.

I dont have a fixation on any one brand, but this is a Tokai forum and passions will run high if you even suggest your Gibson is better made !


But it dont change the fact that recent Tokais ( The MIK ones mostly ) are coming out of the factory in a real poor state.

 

[Jamieh]

These threads are getting silly

Why is there so much bitching around?

Surely if there is a quality control issue with Tokai guitars Tokai will have to srot it out.

The guitars I have had in here have all been extremely good.

As guitarslinger has said several times, the dealers should keep an eye out for problems and send them back so the customers should not recieve any dodgy guitars anyway! If a bad one does slip through the net (which of course happens... we are only human!) then the dealer should rectify the position.

I am sure there are some less than honourable dealers out there, and also there are members of staff in shops who may not know absolutely what is meant to happen in given situations so could unwittingly cause conflict, however, the good dealers with properly trained staff should not cause you any issues.

As consumers we are constantly striving to get stuff cheaper and cheaper, but we expect nothing to suffer! That's just not possible is it?!

 

[Deadman]

There's bitching because we have two different sides here at the moment Jamie.

There are those who don't want to hear about the current issues and those who do.

I want to hear about them but can understand the older ones who are stuck in their ways and getting a little hot under the collar at these newbies who are upseting their beautiful site. :-?

It's human psychology. Pure and simple.

 

[bruceboomstick]

There has been 1 post appearing on a lot of forums - I am supprised that such niche market supplier can gernerat so much web interest !!!

Be interesting if any regulars who have a relationship with ishibashi can trawl up some deifinitive answer. I'm not being suspicious - but I think the info could do with validating - after all the web is not best place to find facts

 

[Jamieh]

There has been 1 post appearing on a lot of forums - I am supprised that such niche market supplier can gernerat so much web interest !!!

Be interesting if any regulars who have a relationship with ishibashi can trawl up some deifinitive answer. I'm not being suspicious - but I think the info could do with validating - after all the web is not best place to find facts

Good point

Perhaps someone should email them?

Maybe I will, I did enquire about sourcing something hard to find from them recently, I shall follow it up with asking them to clarify this point.

 

[20 century boy]

There has been 1 post appearing on a lot of forums - I am supprised that such niche market supplier can gernerat so much web interest !!!

Be interesting if any regulars who have a relationship with ishibashi can trawl up some deifinitive answer. I'm not being suspicious - but I think the info could do with validating - after all the web is not best place to find facts

A user from a french guitar forum received more or less the same answer from Ishibashi.

 

[supreme]

Yep, it is not just 1 email from 1 guy. Many have posted about it together with people who said that they have not been impressed with the Tokais of late....including on this forum by people who had more than 100 posts and have been a member for more than a year (about not being impressed by the quality, I don't know if they emailed Ishibashi). whitewall, a long time member here (joined 28 July 2004, has 177 posts) actually said :

I've stopped buying all things Tokai. Last year I bought a LS90F/L that was pretty nice except for the pups. This year I bought the same guitar. Better pups, nicer top - laminate- but it weighed in at over 10LBs and had numerous detail flaws in it. The other 2 people I talked to who bought the same model from the same run also had 10+ lb. guitars. The MIK ones we get in the states thru canada are sometmes so bad as to be laughable. I had an SG that had body edges so sharp you could cut yourself on them. Tokai ? -- bye bye.

So it's not just some "newbies" who are here with a conspiracy. Why don't ALL the long-time members here email Ishibashi and ask them about it?

[email protected]

Put "International Question" in the email header, that will make them respond.

 

[20 century boy]

Why don't ALL the long-time members here email Ishibashi and ask them about it?

[email protected]

Because the people at Ishibashi might have other things to do than to aswer 10 000 time the same question.

 

[mike martin]

dont know if this throws any light on the qc of tokai.
about 6 months ago i emailed noriko at ishi's shop trying to get a goldstar neck, and the reply was that no more tokai strats were being made by them, but that japanese fenders were now being made by tokai, now if that is the case which i have no reason to disbelieve, i cant see fender putting up with dodgy guitars so i wonder why the qc has dropped so much on loverocks

 

[Anonymous]

Hi hello! First post here, long time lurker though I'm a active user over at the Seymour Duncan forum since about a year and a half back.

Bought my Tokai LS-80 MVF from Ishibashi last autumn. Love the guitar, great quality/price ratio.

Some guys wrote here that they wanted more "proof" directly from Ishibashi not just some net rumor that's floating around. So I figured that I'll register and post here as well.

pongx contacted me via mail after reading about my Tokai over at the SD Forum and showed me the mail he got from Ishibashi. Coincidentally my friend came over and we looked at a Tokai for him as he's in need of a new guitar.

When I logged in on my mail and I was about to send a mail to Ishibashi (my friend wanted help with the ordering and all so we used my mail adress) I noticed that pongx had written the mail to me. Well we read it through and decided to still go ahead and send regular ordering mail to Ishibashi with question regarding shipping, prices etc. and see what they would answer to us with. Yesterday Ace Shirai from Ishibashi replied to my friend (on my mail) with a similar answer as pongx got.

Here's a direct quote from that mail:

First of all, please understand our situation. We do not sell any Tokai
guitar at our stores. We have carried it only in case a customer wants.
We will quit to handle any Tokai guitar in the end of this month because
of chronic shortage of their products and quality problems.

Tokai does not have any LS85 in stock. An order in advance is always
required for it. Excepted arrival date is unknown. Possibly, you will
have to wait for 2-3 months after you place your order. Our best price
is 68,000 Yen. It comes with a soft case.
Shipping cost of them is 16,000 Yen.
Anyway, this month is the last chance for an order of Tokai. If you
purchase a Tokai guitar from us, please place your order soon and complete
payment by the end of June.
Also, we have often seen finish problems for current Tokai products,
including a scratch or a dent or a rough paint work. We cannot accept
returning for reason of such problems.

I started a thread about this on the SD Forum as well. And pongx started one here. I just wanted to provide you with the whole story so you know that it isn't just someone trying to mess up the rep of Tokai or something.

I wouldn't trade my LS80, it's a superb guitar and Tokai makes some awsome quality guitars overall. It's very sad if this is these quality issues/long waiting periods etc. is the future of Tokai guitars. That's why I think all of you also should know about this since it seems that there's problems somewhere and this is after all The Place for Tokai owners.

All the best! eresseraca

 

[Schocker]

I will continue to enjoy, play and support Tokai, but I will never buy another one after the recent spate of poor quality ones I have seen.

You will NEVER buy another Tokai because they've apparently made some bad ones?! You're going to stick to Gibson, the company renowned for its consistency in quality...hmmm! :-?

If you read my previous posts, you'll know I'm objective in my opinions and this isn't a cheap Gibson-bash. However, I find it ironic that after one period of alleged quality issues you will discard Tokai in favour of Gibson! Guess that circle's a-turnin'...

By the way, whoever keeps citing MIK Tokais as examples of the company's supposed drop in quality, what has that to do with MIJ Tokais other than the name on the headstock? With most MIK brands you may as well stick the names on with velcro for all the connection they have with the companies! Next we'll be getting 'evidence' that those fake Tokais that have been turning up on eBay recently somehow 'prove' that MIJ Love Rocks are inherently flawed!!

If Tokai are making dodgy guitars - and Supreme's definitely was - then I will certainly not deny it (read my previous posts, as I said). Mass hysteria, though...well, that's just naff.

...japanese fenders were now being made by tokai, now if that is the case which i have no reason to disbelieve, i cant see fender putting up with dodgy guitars so i wonder why the qc has dropped so much on loverocks.

Similar thoughts occurred to me. Overstretched resources? Priority being given to the FJ models? Certainly the FJ I got a couple of months ago showed no signs of quality control issues; it's probably the best FJ guitar I've bought. But let's stop this before we start the demise of Fender Japan too!

 

[ganzua]

Hi hello! First post here, long time lurker though I'm a active user over at the Seymour Duncan forum since about a year and a half back.

Bought my Tokai LS-80 MVF from Ishibashi last autumn. Love the guitar, great quality/price ratio.

Some guys wrote here that they wanted more "proof" directly from Ishibashi not just some net rumor that's floating around. So I figured that I'll register and post here as well.

pongx contacted me via mail after reading about my Tokai over at the SD Forum and showed me the mail he got from Ishibashi. Coincidentally my friend came over and we looked at a Tokai for him as he's in need of a new guitar.

When I logged in on my mail and I was about to send a mail to Ishibashi (my friend wanted help with the ordering and all so we used my mail adress) I noticed that pongx had written the mail to me. Well we read it through and decided to still go ahead and send regular ordering mail to Ishibashi with question regarding shipping, prices etc. and see what they would answer to us with. Yesterday Ace Shirai from Ishibashi replied to my friend (on my mail) with a similar answer as pongx got.

Here's a direct quote from that mail:

First of all, please understand our situation. We do not sell any Tokai
guitar at our stores. We have carried it only in case a customer wants.
We will quit to handle any Tokai guitar in the end of this month because
of chronic shortage of their products and quality problems.

Tokai does not have any LS85 in stock. An order in advance is always
required for it. Excepted arrival date is unknown. Possibly, you will
have to wait for 2-3 months after you place your order. Our best price
is 68,000 Yen. It comes with a soft case.
Shipping cost of them is 16,000 Yen.
Anyway, this month is the last chance for an order of Tokai. If you
purchase a Tokai guitar from us, please place your order soon and complete
payment by the end of June.
Also, we have often seen finish problems for current Tokai products,
including a scratch or a dent or a rough paint work. We cannot accept
returning for reason of such problems.

I started a thread about this on the SD Forum as well. And pongx started one here. I just wanted to provide you with the whole story so you know that it isn't just someone trying to mess up the rep of Tokai or something.

I wouldn't trade my LS80, it's a superb guitar and Tokai makes some awsome quality guitars overall. It's very sad if this is these quality issues/long waiting periods etc. is the future of Tokai guitars. That's why I think all of you also should know about this since it seems that there's problems somewhere and this is after all The Place for Tokai owners.

All the best! eresseraca

Could you please tell us the date of this email?