Greco Dry Z pickups

[MIJvintage]

Hi,

no one has pics of uncovered Dry Z ?

I will be taking the covers off of my matched set, some time soon ........

will post pics here when done .......

EDIT: 8/2/09 see here http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=14150

 

[greco_burst]

If you want to, how about emailing Maxon about the magnets used in the various pickups like the U-1000, U-2000, PU-2, Dry Z etc and the differences between the pickups.

Hi japanstrat,

I have emailed Maxon, who were very helpful with me, and then I received this reply recently,

Quote
We tried to find the old technical information and checked thoroughly about all the pickups. However, there was no information that we can trace from model number such as U-4000. All the information we have in the warehouse is just delivery numbers for guitar assembly factory.

All the information we can provide is as follows.
Alnico3, Alnico 5 and Alnico8 were used for Alnico pickups. For Ceramic pickups, Ferritic2 and Ferritic3.2 were used.

Regarding the serial number, we sent you the information before. That's the all the information we can provide.

Best regards,
Unquote

 

[japanstrat]

Great work.

From that info it looks like the Maxon Greco Dry Z pickups are Alnico 3 like the Maxon Ibanez Super 58's and the Dry Z and Super 58's could be very similar to each other.
It also looks like the Maxon Greco U-2000 and PU-2 are Alnico 5 and the U-1000 are Alnico 8 like the Maxon Ibanez Super 70s and the lowest UD pickups were most likely Ceramic.

That's for the years up to late 1981/early 1982.
In late 1981, Fujigen start making the Greco pickups like Dry 82, Screamin etc.

 

[Koubayashi]

The 1 = Dyna Gakki and 2 = Fujigen for the first number of the serial comes from a Japanese guy who was taking a guess.

It turns out that it's not true.

For instance, the Ibanez 70s guitars have Super 70s made by Maxon as were the Greco pickups, with a 1 and 2 first serial number.

Now I know from Jim Donahue who worked for Ibanez that Ibanez were never made by Dyna Gakki except for the Ibanez Blazer series.

So the 1 = Dyna Gakki and 2 = Fujigen = BS.

Also there are Grecos around with one pickup starting with a 1 and the other pickup starting with a 2 in the same guitar.

The 1 and 2 beginning pickup serial numbers are in both the YXXXX and MYYXXXX Greco guitar serial number formats.
The YXXXX and MYYXXXX Greco guitar serial number formats are both Fujigen's from looking at the guitars body routing.
The different YXXXX and MYYXXXX Greco guitar serial number formats might be due to different distribution around Japan.

Sometimes, Fujigen would install what pickups were hanging aound the factory.

I've seen a late 1970s Greco that had Super 70 pickups installed rather than the U-3000 or U-4000 pickups that the Greco was supposed to have had.

Super 70s, U-1000, Dry Z etc are all Maxon pickups up until late 1981.

The second number of the serial number is the year and the 3rd or 3rd and 4th number is the month (depending on if it's a 5 or 6 digit serial number, 5 digit serial = one digit for the month) and the end two numbers are the day.

Fujigen took over from Maxon as the pickup maker for Grecos and Ibanez's in late 1981 so most Greco Super Reals and 70 Grecos have Maxon made pickups and so do the 70s Ibanez guitars.

The Dry Z's might have a A3 magnet, which might be part of their sound.
The U-2000 seems to have a A5 magnet and the U-1000 seems to have a A8 magnet like the Super 70s.

Tracking down a A3 magnet and putting it in a U-2000 pickup might make it close to a Dry Z.
I don't really know because I havn't tried it.

I know that their are magnet difference between the low to high end Maxon Greco pickups but I'm not sure of any winding or wire differences.

If there is no difference between a Dry Z and a U-2000 pickup in terms of winding or wire differences then just changing magnets will make one become the other.

The original price difference of a Dry Z and a U-2000 was not huge so they might be very similar and maybe the same but with different magnets.

Dry 20,000 Yen
PU-2 15,000 Yen
U-2000 12,000 Yen
U-1000 10,000 Yen

Maxon seemed to have been copying the Gibson T-top pickups rather than Gibson PAF's for the Dry Z and U-1000 etc and Maxon used different magnets for the different pickup models.
The Maxon bobbin design looks like a Gibson T-top design and it makes a bit of sense that in the 70s Maxon would copy a Gibson T-top rather than a Gibson PAF as all the vintage BS wasn't really there in the 70s and the T-tops were more recent and the ones to copy.

Do you find it plausible that Super Reals with Dry-Z made after Fujigen took over does not have any stamps? I have a set from a 1200 and they have nothing on them. I am 99.9% sure they were the original pickups cause the joints were factory made.

Is there a way to check what magnets they have? any other way to identify them?

 

[japanstrat]

From what I've seen, the Fujigen pickups vary with some stamped and others not stamped.
Any pickup after late 1981 without a Maxon stamp format is probably a Fujigen made pickup including the pickups that begin with a number 5 stamp that is not a Maxon stamp format.
Up until late 1981 all the Greco pickups follow the Maxon stamp format.

The Fujigen made pickups are Dry 82, Double Trick, The Groove and Screamin and pickups beginning with a 5 stamp.

The Fujigen made pickups are mostly in the Mint Collection starting in 1982.

The Maxon made pickups are Dry Z, PU-2 etc, U-2000, U-1000, U-3000, U-4000 and UD.

The Maxon made pickups are in most Grecos up till late 1981 including most Super Reals and late 1981 is very near when the Mint Collection start in 1982.

The Maxon magnets are Alnico 3 for Dry Z and the Alnico 3 gives a 50s PAF sort of tone.

For the Maxon U-2000 and PU-2 the magnets are Alnico 5 giving a standard sort of tone ie Angus.

For the Maxon U-1000 the magnets are Alnico 8 which gives a brighter tone the same as the Ibanez Super 70s.

The Maxon UD pickups are probably ceramic.


The Fujgen Dry 82 pickups are probably Alnico 3 or maybe Alnico 2 and the Screamin is probably ceramic and the other Fujigen pickups are probably Alnico 5.


To measure the magnets a gaussmeter is needed.

To tell the difference between Alnico and Ceramic magnets a simple test can be done with a ohm meter.


Take an ohm meter and touch the probes to the magnet.

Alnico is a metal, and you will see a very low resistance reading.

Ceramic is not a metal, and the resistance reading will be very, very high....if you get any reading whatsoever.

 

[Koubayashi]

From what I've seen, the Fujigen pickups vary with some stamped and others not stamped.
Any pickup after late 1981 without a Maxon stamp format is probably a Fujigen made pickup including the pickups that begin with a number 5 stamp that is not a Maxon stamp format.
Up until late 1981 all the Greco pickups follow the Maxon stamp format.

The Fujigen made pickups are Dry 82, Double Trick, The Groove and Screamin and pickups beginning with a 5 stamp.

The Fujigen made pickups are mostly in the Mint Collection starting in 1982.

The Maxon made pickups are Dry Z, PU-2 etc, U-2000, U-1000, U-3000, U-4000 and UD.

The Maxon made pickups are in most Grecos up till late 1981 including most Super Reals and late 1981 is very near when the Mint Collection start in 1982.

The Maxon magnets are Alnico 3 for Dry Z and the Alnico 3 gives a 50s PAF sort of tone.

For the Maxon U-2000 and PU-2 the magnets are Alnico 5 giving a standard sort of tone ie Angus.

For the Maxon U-1000 the magnets are Alnico 8 which gives a brighter tone the same as the Ibanez Super 70s.

The Maxon UD pickups are probably ceramic.


The Fujgen Dry 82 pickups are probably Alnico 3 or maybe Alnico 2 and the Screamin is probably ceramic and the other Fujigen pickups are probably Alnico 5.


To measure the magnets a gaussmeter is needed.

To tell the difference between Alnico and Ceramic magnets a simple test can be done with a ohm meter.


Take an ohm meter and touch the probes to the magnet.

Alnico is a metal, and you will see a very low resistance reading.

Ceramic is not a metal, and the resistance reading will be very, very high....if you get any reading whatsoever.

The Screamin pickups are ceramic. I have "dissected" one.