japanstrat
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IMO the only way to get a totally made Japanese guitar would be to not buy anything after 1985.
Outsourcing was used by FujiGen in 1986 by getting Fender Japan necks made by Atlansia in Japan.
http://www.daeschler.com/articles/fujigen/
http://www.atlansia.jp/
And then there is a guy who worked for Epiphone who says Terada had some Korean factory making stuff for them with Terada cnc machines shiped to Korea in 1989 and I've also heard that FujiGen did the same thing. http://www.banjohangout.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=68668
"Scott will know more about the details, but I know that at least one Japanese fretted instrument factory sent some of its tooling to Korea when Japanese labor got too expensive for making budget instruments. I saw that happening when I was over there in '89 at the Terada factory. They were packing things to ship up to Korea, and there were a number of Korean factories where Japanese were really running the show. Samick was not one of those, though.
Rick Turner"
So at least some of the Terada made G serial Orville by Gibsons appear to have had their parts routed out by Terada owned cnc machines in Korea and then shipped back to Terada in Japan for assembly and finishing.
If you are running a guitar factory and you can get the guitar parts made by the same cnc machines in a country where labour is cheaper then why not do it.
What's it matter if the parts are routed out on a cnc machine in Korea or China and then assembled and finished in Japan, they would still be mostly MIJ .
If the guitars are getting assembled and finished in Korea and China then they would be MIK, MIC.
One of the things that points to where a guitar is finally assembled and finished is the pots.
Seeing that the pots are hidden from buying customers the factories just use the pots that are locally available.
Exporting pots from Japan to Korea or China is just a waste of money for the guitar companies when they are available locally in Korea or China.
The visual parts like tuners and bridges were exported from Japan to Korea.
For instance the Korean Cort made Grecos using Korean Cor-Tek pots and Japanese made tuners and bridges.
If a guitar has MIJ pots then it would point to assembly and finishing in Japan.
The K Orvilles are like this with a lot of them especially around 1992 having Made in Japan stamped pots.
Finishing a guitar in Korea or China and then sending it back to Japan to have the pots, tuners, bridges and pickups installed by Japanese labour makes no sense money wise, you may as well have had the pots, tuners, bridges and pickups installed in Korea or China like the Korean Cort Grecos did but using parts made in Korea or China and then finishing and installing the pots etc in Japan makes sense because they saved money by having the parts made in Korea or China and the guitar is still basically MIJ with just the finishing and assembly done in Japan.
Also shipping parts from Korea to Japan is much easier and cheaper then shipping finished guitars from Korea to Japan unless they had them made very cheaply in Korea as with the Cort made Grecos and they would have Korean pots.
Another thing is the way the decals are applied.
The decals are positioned by hand and there can be variations in positioning from factory to factory especially for a model with a lot of decals like the LP customs.
The Terada Orville by Gibson decals are positioned differently to the FujiGen Orville by Gibson decals and if the K Orvilles were finished in Korea then another decal variation would be expected but if you look at a Orville by Gibson G serial and a K Orville LP custom the decal positioning is the same, which means both of them are being finished in the same factory.
If you look at the necks and headstocks and bodies shapes of the Terada G serial Orville by Gibson LP's and SG's and the K Orville LP's and SG's they are the same, which means they were routed out by Terada owned cnc machines using the same programming coordinates in either Korea or Japan.
I think Terada used their cnc machines in Korea to route most of the Orville by Gibsons and K Orville parts and only used their cnc machines in Japan for the top of the line Orville by Gibsons.
Also there is the selling price which can point to parts coming from Korea or China.
In the case of the Terada K Orvilles, the price of the basic LP's and SG's and LPJ's was roughly the same as the ink stamped FujiGen Orvilles so I would expect that both Terada and FujiGen used Korean made parts because if Terada was doing it for the K Orville selling prices then FujiGen would also have to do it for the ink stamped Orvilles or else FujiGen would make very little profit on the Orvilles.
If the Edwards are being sold at a pretty cheap price then I would expect the parts to come from Korea or China because that's the whole point of outsourcing, to sell at a lower price.
Outsourcing was used by FujiGen in 1986 by getting Fender Japan necks made by Atlansia in Japan.
http://www.daeschler.com/articles/fujigen/
http://www.atlansia.jp/
And then there is a guy who worked for Epiphone who says Terada had some Korean factory making stuff for them with Terada cnc machines shiped to Korea in 1989 and I've also heard that FujiGen did the same thing. http://www.banjohangout.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=68668
"Scott will know more about the details, but I know that at least one Japanese fretted instrument factory sent some of its tooling to Korea when Japanese labor got too expensive for making budget instruments. I saw that happening when I was over there in '89 at the Terada factory. They were packing things to ship up to Korea, and there were a number of Korean factories where Japanese were really running the show. Samick was not one of those, though.
Rick Turner"
So at least some of the Terada made G serial Orville by Gibsons appear to have had their parts routed out by Terada owned cnc machines in Korea and then shipped back to Terada in Japan for assembly and finishing.
If you are running a guitar factory and you can get the guitar parts made by the same cnc machines in a country where labour is cheaper then why not do it.
What's it matter if the parts are routed out on a cnc machine in Korea or China and then assembled and finished in Japan, they would still be mostly MIJ .
If the guitars are getting assembled and finished in Korea and China then they would be MIK, MIC.
One of the things that points to where a guitar is finally assembled and finished is the pots.
Seeing that the pots are hidden from buying customers the factories just use the pots that are locally available.
Exporting pots from Japan to Korea or China is just a waste of money for the guitar companies when they are available locally in Korea or China.
The visual parts like tuners and bridges were exported from Japan to Korea.
For instance the Korean Cort made Grecos using Korean Cor-Tek pots and Japanese made tuners and bridges.
If a guitar has MIJ pots then it would point to assembly and finishing in Japan.
The K Orvilles are like this with a lot of them especially around 1992 having Made in Japan stamped pots.
Finishing a guitar in Korea or China and then sending it back to Japan to have the pots, tuners, bridges and pickups installed by Japanese labour makes no sense money wise, you may as well have had the pots, tuners, bridges and pickups installed in Korea or China like the Korean Cort Grecos did but using parts made in Korea or China and then finishing and installing the pots etc in Japan makes sense because they saved money by having the parts made in Korea or China and the guitar is still basically MIJ with just the finishing and assembly done in Japan.
Also shipping parts from Korea to Japan is much easier and cheaper then shipping finished guitars from Korea to Japan unless they had them made very cheaply in Korea as with the Cort made Grecos and they would have Korean pots.
Another thing is the way the decals are applied.
The decals are positioned by hand and there can be variations in positioning from factory to factory especially for a model with a lot of decals like the LP customs.
The Terada Orville by Gibson decals are positioned differently to the FujiGen Orville by Gibson decals and if the K Orvilles were finished in Korea then another decal variation would be expected but if you look at a Orville by Gibson G serial and a K Orville LP custom the decal positioning is the same, which means both of them are being finished in the same factory.
If you look at the necks and headstocks and bodies shapes of the Terada G serial Orville by Gibson LP's and SG's and the K Orville LP's and SG's they are the same, which means they were routed out by Terada owned cnc machines using the same programming coordinates in either Korea or Japan.
I think Terada used their cnc machines in Korea to route most of the Orville by Gibsons and K Orville parts and only used their cnc machines in Japan for the top of the line Orville by Gibsons.
Also there is the selling price which can point to parts coming from Korea or China.
In the case of the Terada K Orvilles, the price of the basic LP's and SG's and LPJ's was roughly the same as the ink stamped FujiGen Orvilles so I would expect that both Terada and FujiGen used Korean made parts because if Terada was doing it for the K Orville selling prices then FujiGen would also have to do it for the ink stamped Orvilles or else FujiGen would make very little profit on the Orvilles.
If the Edwards are being sold at a pretty cheap price then I would expect the parts to come from Korea or China because that's the whole point of outsourcing, to sell at a lower price.
