1981 Greco Spacey Sound

[Sigmania]

Does anyone know what model this would be?

It looks to me from the pics that the body is a one piece.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360651443092&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123

 

[muccax]

hi
look really nice ,,,, i got 7 spacey sound ,,,,, the are great guitars .... but i have been fooled about how many pieces the body is made of .... ... i got one 2 piece ,,, but all the other are 3 piece body .... they did a really good job ,, about finding matching Wood ,,,, i only got one rose Wood neck ,,, they are more rare ,,,,,

but this one could be a one piece


i just got a 1980 super sound ....57 model v neck .... has a sticker se 600
but it come in nitro ,,,,,,

i was sure it was a 2 piece but it too was a 3 piece ,,,,,
all the best
otto

 

[Sigmania]

Thanks. Here are some pics.

 

[muccax]

i think i can see a small line at the contured body ,,,,,
i will bet a large beer ,,,, that it is a 3 piece body ,,, when you get it
they were really sneakey ,,, when the selected Wood ,,,

 

[Sigmania]

Thanks. I saw that line too so I blew up the image. If you look further down it looks like the grain goes across that line.

Will see soon when I get my grubby hands on it.

 

[muccax]

would be really nice with a one piece body ,,,,,,
but 2 or 3 piece body can not take away that they are great guitars
were underrated in my view ,,,,,,
just as good as tokai
and much cheaper

 

[muccax]

3 piece body

 

[muccax]

spacey sound

 

[Sigmania]

Very nice!

I have a 1978 SE600N Super Sound ( 2 piece Sen Ash)

(Pics from the seller in Japan. Since then I have found the missing parts).









and a 1979 SE500W Super Sounds.





They both have EXCEL pickups which I think sound amazing.

From the poles on this one I was thinking it might have them too.

What pups do yours have?

 

[muccax]

all my spacey sound has pickups with 31xxx on the bottom of the pickups

and there are 2 difference kind of excels pick ups
they dont have the same spacing betwin the magnets ,,,, and i think before sometime in 1979 ,,,,, greco se models are made by matsomuko factory
easy to tell ,,, if the pickup routing is more strait not only round it is a matsomuko made greco
after 1979 greco made the right spacing vintage correct
but before both string and pickup spacing are not the vintage correct
so when you look for spareparts for greco ,,, the dont allways fit
i have 2 necks ,,,,, super sound ,,,, that dont fit spacey sound ...
(fujigen and matsomuko ) you can not use a neck from matsumoko on a fujigen body

 

[Sigmania]

Thanks. I knew about the change of the pickguards/pickups in early 1979.

The Matsumoku/Fujigen shift was earlier than that.

One easy way to tell is that Fujigen has a very specific system for serial numbers after 1975. First letter is the month followed by the year code, etc.

My 78 and 79 SEs are both Fujigen builds and great guitars. I don't have the same feeling about Uncle Mat guitars. :wink:

The one in the OP is a "K81". Neck plates for my other two are posted below.

Note: Ibanez Silver Series (fujigen) had the same EXCEL pickups in them in 1977.

 

[muccax]

hi
as far as i know ,,,,, this kind of routing is matsumuko



and this is fujigen

 

[Sigmania]

Interesting. What makes you think that is a Matsumoku route? Have you seen other Uncle Mat guitars with that route?

If so, that would be the first time I have heard of them using the Fujigen style serial number system without "MATSUMOKU" on the neck plate.

Would love to know how you figured that out.

Thanks for the help.

 

[muccax]

i just think they changed the neck plate from matsumoku to only serial number ,,,,, did not look good ,,,, a fujigen guitar with matsumoku on the neck plate ,,,,,
i dont remember where i saw that ,,,, i follow more than one forum ,,,, but i will look for where i found it ,,,,,

 

[muccax]

hi
found this one in the closet
a aria pro ,,, striking sound ,,,, with dimarzio pickups ,,, a 1979 ...









so thats why i think it is a matsumuko routing ,,,,, i dont think your guitars are fujigen ,,,,, i think they are matsumuko

 

[Sigmania]

Interesting.

Look at the control cavity on My 1979 SE500 and on your white guitar. It's actually a different shape than your Matsumoku guitar.




I think it's possible that Matsumoku contracted with Fujigen to have them build guitars or vice versa.

I have seen a Penco ( another Fujigen brand) with this neckplate and the Fujigen style number, but it also clearly said "MATSUMOKU" on it.

I'm checking with the Ibanez collectors to see if I can get a pic of a control cavity for a Silver Series or Challenger Ibanez strat guitar.

This is good stuff! Thanks!

 

[muccax]

they look the same to me ,,,, i can see that that greco has the same pickup routing ,,, but it has a small extra one for the switch ,,,,,
they dont look like anything else ,,,, tokai Fernandes fresher to name a few
only matsumuko has this Sharp Square routing ,,,, and hole for easy ajustment of the truss rod

 

[Sigmania]

Look at the area under the pick-up selector. The two Grecos from 1979 have an indented area to accommodate the selector in the control cavity, from what I can see the Matsumoku guitar you pictured does not.

The shape of the control cavity is different as well.

Obviously the routes changed as did the pickups EXCEL pickups themselves. Note with the pickups that it's one brand two versions.

Honestly, I think what you are seeing is Greco/Fujigen's attempt to more closely copy the Fender specs. And may simplyindicate when they retooled at the factory (CNC, etc.).

Just my opinion.

If it were a Matsumaoku build I believe it would say MATSUMOKU or the brand, or STEEL ADJUSTABLE NECK and MADE IN JAPAN in the same font that they always used.

Again, just my opinion.

I assume someone else here will come along and add their knowledge of when that shift occured.

 

[Sigmania]

The more I think about it the more I am convinced this is simply Fujigen switching over to produce guitars that were more faithful replicas of the 1950s and 1960s originals.

The routes on your red Greco looks like Vintage pre 1970s Fender routes to me. The more square 79 Grecos look more like 1970s Fender routes.

By the way, my SE500 is a big head guitar, so it may have been intentional? Is your white guitar big or small head?

In the mid 70s Fujigen was building Greco and other replicas of Les Pauls based on catalog pics and photographs. As a result they had no idea what the backs of the guitars looked like so they made their version of 59 LP replicas with sunburst backs. It wasn't til later that they got a chance to look at real vintage Les Pauls.

I assume the same happened with Fender. I think it simply took a while to get pre 70s guitars to look at and measure.

Again, someone else will hopefully come along soon that has more info.
:wink:

Look here for pics of a 1956 Strat.

http://www.12fret.com/content/2011/11/28/fender-stratocaster-1956-consignment/


And here is a 1975 Fender route:

http://www.vintage-guitars.se/1975_Fender_Stratocaster_560444.htm

And this page is interesting:

http://home.provide.net/~cfh/fender.html

 

[muccax]

hi i got a 77 sparkle sound ,,,, yes ..... it has a 4 bolt neck plate ...Excel pickups ,,,,, and look like the White body i post Pictures of before
seen one before ,,,, but i think they are rare ,,,,,,,,
a fine guitar





hand crafted ,,,,, special made yes yes ,,,,, they use cool names on there guitars