Photo of neck joints...Discuss.
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villager
Well-known member
thats not stictly true,
the first is a rocker joint, used to make getting the neck angle right more easy, its a **** way of making a contact between the neck and body,
the second and 3rd are in truth almost identical, as they are flat joints which have great body to neck contact, the extra 2cm length makes no tonal difference, it just copying a 59 to better spec...
old tokais use the 2nd joint , newer high end use the 3rd,
but, in my opinion, there is no good reason for any tonal supremicy of 3 over 2, the extra wood is so little, it would be superseeded by things like solid tailpiece connections or locking bridge, which at theat level of minutae are equally important..
in summery 1 is a cheap way of making a neck angle easily and a real tonal compromise as there is very little neck to body contact,
2 and 3 in my view are both great neck joints...
the first is a rocker joint, used to make getting the neck angle right more easy, its a **** way of making a contact between the neck and body,
the second and 3rd are in truth almost identical, as they are flat joints which have great body to neck contact, the extra 2cm length makes no tonal difference, it just copying a 59 to better spec...
old tokais use the 2nd joint , newer high end use the 3rd,
but, in my opinion, there is no good reason for any tonal supremicy of 3 over 2, the extra wood is so little, it would be superseeded by things like solid tailpiece connections or locking bridge, which at theat level of minutae are equally important..
in summery 1 is a cheap way of making a neck angle easily and a real tonal compromise as there is very little neck to body contact,
2 and 3 in my view are both great neck joints...
villager
Well-known member
no the first is a rocker joint, the other two are not, so I dont think its actually defined by the ''shortness'' of the tenon, as its a completely different type of joint...
yes your statement is true, but I think the labelling on the diagram is misleading..
yes your statement is true, but I think the labelling on the diagram is misleading..
marcusnieman
Well-known member
villager said:
I think the real gist of his question is:
Are examples 2 and 3 more in line with Tokai manufacturing and is example 1 more Gibson like.
villager
Well-known member
yes but 3 is a historic..
leadguitar_323
Well-known member
This is a tokai "long tenon" in my LS-180
This is my Gold top
Mick
This is my Gold top
Mick
A
Anonymous
Guest
So what sort of joint does a basic Japanese Love Rock have? Not a top end model, the entry level model, whatever model number it is this week. :roll:
Mike
Mike
bobwise
Active member
All three of those are genuine Gibson neck joints. Pics 1&3 are about 6 years old and originally came from Gibson's website -- they took a couple of seconds/rejects and sawed them in half, took them out behind the factory and snapped a couple of pics. Pic 2 obviously has the same background so we can assume it's also a Gibson pic showing the new-for-'08 tenon.
The "transitional" tenon is also called a "medium" tenon and was introduced on the updated '08 Les Paul Standard. The rocker tenon may still be used on Studios and BFG's and such (I'm not sure -- it may be standard on all the non-Historic LPs now). Historics still have the long tenon of course. But all current LP Standards now have a very nice neck joint.
They're starting to catch up -- their regular production LP finally has a neck joint as good as the joint Tokai was using 30 years ago.
Other updates: locking Tone Pros bridge and stopbar, Neutrik output jack, asymmetric neck profile, strap locks, gold-plated Bournes pots :roll: , Alnico V Burstbucker Pros, and the frets are now PLEKed just like the Historics. Also locking tuners -- seems kind of goofy to me on a hardtail, but they do make string changes a little quicker.
You've got to give them some credit -- they made some significant upgrades in '08 and the new LP Standards might be able to compete with a new LS80.
But the street price has jumped to $2500 -- a lot more than I paid for my '80 LS120 a couple of years ago and you could buy 3 new LS80s for that much. And the new Gibson is still chambered, so it's kind of a "Les Paul variant" rather than a "real LP" to me. :wink:
The "transitional" tenon is also called a "medium" tenon and was introduced on the updated '08 Les Paul Standard. The rocker tenon may still be used on Studios and BFG's and such (I'm not sure -- it may be standard on all the non-Historic LPs now). Historics still have the long tenon of course. But all current LP Standards now have a very nice neck joint.
They're starting to catch up -- their regular production LP finally has a neck joint as good as the joint Tokai was using 30 years ago.
Other updates: locking Tone Pros bridge and stopbar, Neutrik output jack, asymmetric neck profile, strap locks, gold-plated Bournes pots :roll: , Alnico V Burstbucker Pros, and the frets are now PLEKed just like the Historics. Also locking tuners -- seems kind of goofy to me on a hardtail, but they do make string changes a little quicker.
You've got to give them some credit -- they made some significant upgrades in '08 and the new LP Standards might be able to compete with a new LS80.
But the street price has jumped to $2500 -- a lot more than I paid for my '80 LS120 a couple of years ago and you could buy 3 new LS80s for that much. And the new Gibson is still chambered, so it's kind of a "Les Paul variant" rather than a "real LP" to me. :wink:
