Help about a burny SG

[Platypusproducer]

Hi everyone!

I’m new to the world of Japanese guitar, and I recently acquired a beautiful burny sg supposedly from around 85 - 90!

I imagine there must be thousands of post like this one on here, so I apologize, but I would love to learn more about this guitar, because honestly this is one of the best guitar I played!

So I snagged this beauty for 600$, it’s in great cosmetic condition appart from worn out frets and a small crack in the neck joint which is worrying me a little (though my luthier says it’s just the finish and not in the wood). The finish appears to be poly.

I would like to know the history behind this guitar, is it one of those regarded as equal to a Gibson ? Or is it one from the era where the quality of production started to decline ?

I haven’t opened it up yet, I don’t know if there’s VH1 pickup in it but I’m interested in the history behind burny guitars. I think I’m going to sold some of my fenders to buy more burny 😎



Thanks for your help !!

 

[Platypusproducer]

Forgot to add: No serial on the guitar, it's very lightweight, and neck feels relatively slim
I will post pictures of the electronics and pickup cavities tomorrow !

I can’t tell if the hardware is nickel or chrome btw

 

[Voidoid56]

That style of truss rod cover was introduced in 1989, so it's no earlier than that. It's likely to have a date stamp (not a true, unique serial number) in the neck pickup cavity and/or date-coded pots, so get us some pics of those.

The model would be RSG-65 '63 BL, or possibly RSG-60 '63 BL, if it was manufactured in 1989. Same guitar, just a changed designation, the number is the recommended retail price (60 or 65k JPY in this case) and they had to adjust it for inflation, I suppose. BL is the finish code for black. At that point, the manufacturer should be Dyna Gakki (Fender's current Japanese supplier, I believe).

Burny is an alternate badge owned by Fernandes, mostly used on Gibson copies (though Fernandes-branded ones turn up as well). They were made by several different OEM manufacturers through the years, but the quality is remarkably consistent from the early 80's into at least the mid-90's, at least in my experience. Ppl seem to prefer older guitars (I guess they seem more "vintage") but the early 90's guitars I've had have been very, very good indeed.

Original pickups will be 2nd generation VH-1s. These are well-respected and sound fine, but much of the hype around the designation comes from the original 80's 1 st gen pickups, which are among the best MIJ PAF copies around.

1991 catalog page. The scan quality is pretty bad, but I think you can make out most of the specs.

https://www.fernandes.co.jp/fer_wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/1991_03.pdf

 

[Platypusproducer]

That style of truss rod cover was introduced in 1989, so it's no earlier than that. It's likely to have a date stamp (not a true, unique serial number) in the neck pickup cavity and/or date-coded pots, so get us some pics of those.

The model would be RSG-65 '63 BL, or possibly RSG-60 '63 BL, if it was manufactured in 1989. Same guitar, just a changed designation, the number is the recommended retail price (60 or 65k JPY in this case) and they had to adjust it for inflation, I suppose. BL is the finish code for black. At that point, the manufacturer should be Dyna Gakki (Fender's current Japanese supplier, I believe).

Burny is an alternate badge owned by Fernandes, mostly used on Gibson copies (though Fernandes-branded ones turn up as well). They were made by several different OEM manufacturers through the years, but the quality is remarkably consistent from the early 80's into at least the mid-90's, at least in my experience. Ppl seem to prefer older guitars (I guess they seem more "vintage") but the early 90's guitars I've had have been very, very good indeed.

Original pickups will be 2nd generation VH-1s. These are well-respected and sound fine, but much of the hype around the designation comes from the original 80's 1 st gen pickups, which are among the best MIJ PAF copies around.

1991 catalog page. The scan quality is pretty bad, but I think you can make out most of the specs.

https://www.fernandes.co.jp/fer_wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/1991_03.pdf

Wow thanks man! That's very helpfufl!

 

[Platypusproducer]

That style of truss rod cover was introduced in 1989, so it's no earlier than that. It's likely to have a date stamp (not a true, unique serial number) in the neck pickup cavity and/or date-coded pots, so get us some pics of those.

The model would be RSG-65 '63 BL, or possibly RSG-60 '63 BL, if it was manufactured in 1989. Same guitar, just a changed designation, the number is the recommended retail price (60 or 65k JPY in this case) and they had to adjust it for inflation, I suppose. BL is the finish code for black. At that point, the manufacturer should be Dyna Gakki (Fender's current Japanese supplier, I believe).

Burny is an alternate badge owned by Fernandes, mostly used on Gibson copies (though Fernandes-branded ones turn up as well). They were made by several different OEM manufacturers through the years, but the quality is remarkably consistent from the early 80's into at least the mid-90's, at least in my experience. Ppl seem to prefer older guitars (I guess they seem more "vintage") but the early 90's guitars I've had have been very, very good indeed.

Original pickups will be 2nd generation VH-1s. These are well-respected and sound fine, but much of the hype around the designation comes from the original 80's 1 st gen pickups, which are among the best MIJ PAF copies around.

1991 catalog page. The scan quality is pretty bad, but I think you can make out most of the specs.

https://www.fernandes.co.jp/fer_wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/1991_03.pdf

Okay so here are some pictures of the pots!
I tried my burny against a Maybach Les Paul copy that my friend owns, the Maybach is obviously a way more expensive guitar,, but I found that the burny lacked a lot of beefiness in the low end, lacked some sparkle and chime and was overall a duller sounding guitar, I haven't opened the pickup cavity yet, so I don't know exactly what pickups are in there yet, but I'm considering maybe replacing them, because I'm not a big fan of how the guitar sounds, I'm in love with how it feels though!
Do you guys think it's worth swapping out the pickups? Will it make a big difference?
Thanks!

 

[Voidoid56]

Well that's bad luck. The GF pot is a replacement, the other three could well be original, but of a type with no date code. There were apparently several suppliers around, some dated their pots, some didn't. Most Burnys of that era have pots with embossed markings, incl a date code below the Ohm number. The aluminium screen is not original. Nothing in the neck pickup cavity?

In my experience, yeah, replacing the pickups can make a lot of difference, of course. But I'm not sure you can make an SG sound exactly like a Les Paul, the construction colours the sound a lot as well. Either way, keep the originals in case you want to sell the guitar in the future. Vintage guitar rules apply, and original is always king.

 

[mdvineng]

Okay so here are some pictures of the pots!
I tried my burny against a Maybach Les Paul copy that my friend owns, the Maybach is obviously a way more expensive guitar,, but I found that the burny lacked a lot of beefiness in the low end, lacked some sparkle and chime and was overall a duller sounding guitar, I haven't opened the pickup cavity yet, so I don't know exactly what pickups are in there yet, but I'm considering maybe replacing them, because I'm not a big fan of how the guitar sounds, I'm in love with how it feels though!
Do you guys think it's worth swapping out the pickups? Will it make a big difference?
Thanks!

pick up heights and the 6 screws being adjusted could help a lot with the sound quality.

Fernandes - Burny Archives - Vintage Japan Guitars

vintagejapanguitars.com

 

[PermissionToLand]

Pickups make the biggest difference in sound of any mod you can make to a guitar. Going from cheap ceramic pickups to quality alnicos is night and day.

I'd bet money that most could not tell the difference between an SG and LP *with the same pickups* blindfolded. Different pickup locations would be the only slightly significant impact on sound. Don't get me started on "tonewood"...

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

From all I read about Burnys over the years the non-aftermarket VH-1 stock pickups that popped up in the late 80s are universally frowned upon. Now that's hearsay as I never had the opportunity to hear them but the unanimity of the voices considering them junk the least desirable of the VH bunch and your assessment on top do indicate that there might be some truth to it. 🙂

 

[Voidoid56]

I've had several guitars with the later VH-1s: a couple of RLC's and an RSG from around 1990 and a 1990 RSA-70. Generally, they sounded great in the former but was all wrong in the latter. They're pretty strident in the midrange and overall somewhat angry-sounding, which - to my ears - works in a rock n roll bruiser like an LP Custom or an SG. They lacked the sweetness needed to make a 335-style guitar sound like a 335, though.
I also have an 1987 RLG-90 with an earlier type of VH-1, with the woven ground sleeve cable and a very PAF-like tone. As I understand it, wether or not that type (apparently original to mid-80's high-end Burnys) is the same as the initial aftermarket VH-1 is contested. Either way, I found a set of similar earlier VH-1s for the RSA-70, and they totally transformed the tone of that guitar.

 

[Homer J. Simpson]

Hi Voidoid56,

Indeed, the aftermarket VH-1s had the "braided shield" cables (no plastic cover). But so did the L-800x pre-1982 and when the VH-1 popped up in the catalogs the L-8000 series PUs were still used but got grey plastic insulation wires. It could be speculated that the initial VH-1s were just the old, more true to the original style L-800x rebranded for the new aftermarket pickup line-up 1983.

It seems the assessment of the VH-1s is actually pretty diverse. I wish we had pics of @Platypusproducers' pickup backs and DCR readings (so we could assume "ah those are the bad ones"). I tried to dig a bit into the VH-1 mystery and learned there are indeed two categories of VH-1s after the 1983 aftermarket VH-1, one with generally unmarked (unknown if they have the tiny "N.O." stamp on the cover edge near the base) which are supposedly the earlier ones, and the other with the red framed stickers on the base plate, which seems to be typical for 1990s Gotohs.