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Love Rock truss rod covers
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone know how to date by truss rod cover? I've seen 4 types. The bell and the pointier 'arrow-bell', both used on earlier models and the half-elipse. The half-elipse I've seen with a different number of screws. I have a new Japanese Love Rock with a two screw half-elipse but I've seen Korean ones on ebay.com with 3 screws. I don't know if there is some kind of plan here or they just use whatever is available but does anyone know of the two earlier types? My early Gold Top has a bell shaped one but I don't know if this makes it 70s or 80s. I would like to find out if certain styles were used between certain dates.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Barry Plows']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone know how to date by truss rod cover? I've seen 4 types. The bell and the pointier 'arrow-bell', both used on earlier models and the half-elipse. The half-elipse I've seen with a different number of screws. I have a new Japanese Love Rock with a two screw half-elipse but I've seen Korean ones on ebay.com with 3 screws. I don't know if there is some kind of plan here or they just use whatever is available but does anyone know of the two earlier types? My early Gold Top has a bell shaped one but I don't know if this makes it 70s or 80s. I would like to find out if certain styles were used between certain dates.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Barry Plows']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only info I can add is what my guitar has. It's a ls=50 cherrybursy. It has the arrow bell style. The quality of it is lacking, also. Looks as though it was cut out with a VERY dull saw. Also, it seems as though the love rocks didn't go through the logo style changes that the Strat and Tele copies did. Maybe the truss rod cover was their way of showing some difference before the lawsuits came. If you'll look at the scan of the SRV Tokai Strat on the home page link..you'll see what the earliest Tokai Strat Logo's looked like. From a distance..they look just like Fender logos. I'm looking for answers just like eveyone I think.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Barry Plows']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only info I can add is what my guitar has. It's a ls=50 cherrybursy. It has the arrow bell style. The quality of it is lacking, also. Looks as though it was cut out with a VERY dull saw. Also, it seems as though the love rocks didn't go through the logo style changes that the Strat and Tele copies did. Maybe the truss rod cover was their way of showing some difference before the lawsuits came. If you'll look at the scan of the SRV Tokai Strat on the home page link..you'll see what the earliest Tokai Strat Logo's looked like. From a distance..they look just like Fender logos. I'm looking for answers just like eveyone I think.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Barry Plows']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob,

I found a fellow in Japan with a bunch of Tokai's and pictures. The pictures are of a 78 and a couple of 81 Love Rocks. TR cover looks like what your are describing. Here is the link:

http://www.geocities.co.jp/MusicStar-Guitar/1961/

[Anonymously Posted by: 'john ']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob,

I found a fellow in Japan with a bunch of Tokai's and pictures. The pictures are of a 78 and a couple of 81 Love Rocks. TR cover looks like what your are describing. Here is the link:

http://www.geocities.co.jp/MusicStar-Guitar/1961/

[Anonymously Posted by: 'john ']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow..this question gets even more and more confusing. I noticed that all the models in the link above had bell truss rod covers like the Gibsons. What year was the first Love Rocks supposedly made? I have seen reports that it was the late 60's. I also noticed that the strat copies in the link all had the logo I was talking about. The earlier logo where the T looks just like the F in the fender logo. I have noticed many people selling the later logo Strats as lawsuit models. These with the earlier "spaghetti" logos seem to be commanding the highest prices. (There's a later logo Tokai on ebay now). Anybody have any idea what Tokai's are getting in your markets? Older Love Rocks are much rarer than the Strat copies here..they are getting around 800 for plain tops..and, 1000 for flame tops. Strat copies are around 600-800. Both are very hard to come by. And, while we're discussing variations..my Love Rock has exposed zebra pickups. No evidence of there ever being pup covers at all. Anyone seen this? Here's another link to a pic and some info on a Les Paul Custom Copy..
http://www.magma.ca/~jimid/
notice the headstock inlay on the custom and truss rod cover of the gold top at bottom

[Anonymously Posted by: 'john']
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2001 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow..this question gets even more and more confusing. I noticed that all the models in the link above had bell truss rod covers like the Gibsons. What year was the first Love Rocks supposedly made? I have seen reports that it was the late 60's. I also noticed that the strat copies in the link all had the logo I was talking about. The earlier logo where the T looks just like the F in the fender logo. I have noticed many people selling the later logo Strats as lawsuit models. These with the earlier "spaghetti" logos seem to be commanding the highest prices. (There's a later logo Tokai on ebay now). Anybody have any idea what Tokai's are getting in your markets? Older Love Rocks are much rarer than the Strat copies here..they are getting around 800 for plain tops..and, 1000 for flame tops. Strat copies are around 600-800. Both are very hard to come by. And, while we're discussing variations..my Love Rock has exposed zebra pickups. No evidence of there ever being pup covers at all. Anyone seen this? Here's another link to a pic and some info on a Les Paul Custom Copy..
http://www.magma.ca/~jimid/
notice the headstock inlay on the custom and truss rod cover of the gold top at bottom

[Anonymously Posted by: 'john']
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2001 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow guys, this is a minefield isn't it!!! I didn't know there were so many variations of Love Rocks. I bought mine new in 1988 and it has a bell TR cover. I have a review for one in an old Guitarst magazine dated 1984 with an arrow-bell shown in the photo. I would have thought that the bell came first as was then 'done away with' as I'm sure it was a copyright of Gibson's. Maybe my guitar was 'New Old Stock (NOS)' when purchased and may well be much older than 1988. One of the Tokai sites says they were established in 1947 but they didn't produce replicas at this time. They came later, the 70's I've read. To make things even more confusing there is a Tokai on ebay at the moment with a bolt on neck!!! Is this a move to keep the cost of the new Korean ones down or is it an early model? Ebay is a good source of pictures for Tokai's, I check regularly to see what variations there are between similar models.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Ned']
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2001 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow guys, this is a minefield isn't it!!! I didn't know there were so many variations of Love Rocks. I bought mine new in 1988 and it has a bell TR cover. I have a review for one in an old Guitarst magazine dated 1984 with an arrow-bell shown in the photo. I would have thought that the bell came first as was then 'done away with' as I'm sure it was a copyright of Gibson's. Maybe my guitar was 'New Old Stock (NOS)' when purchased and may well be much older than 1988. One of the Tokai sites says they were established in 1947 but they didn't produce replicas at this time. They came later, the 70's I've read. To make things even more confusing there is a Tokai on ebay at the moment with a bolt on neck!!! Is this a move to keep the cost of the new Korean ones down or is it an early model? Ebay is a good source of pictures for Tokai's, I check regularly to see what variations there are between similar models.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Ned']
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2001 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've noticed something else that I didn't know before. The Blue Tokai on ebay has an arrow-bell TR cover and so presumably cannot be a new Korean model. Also the headstock is different from mine. Both my old and new Tokai's have the Gibson style 'open book' headstock with a v-shape cutout at the top where the 'pages' meet. The blue one on ebay has a shallow and broader u-shape cutout which I've never seen before. Are they copying Gibson's with this design? Can it be used to date Love Rock's?

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Augustin ']
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2001 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've noticed something else that I didn't know before. The Blue Tokai on ebay has an arrow-bell TR cover and so presumably cannot be a new Korean model. Also the headstock is different from mine. Both my old and new Tokai's have the Gibson style 'open book' headstock with a v-shape cutout at the top where the 'pages' meet. The blue one on ebay has a shallow and broader u-shape cutout which I've never seen before. Are they copying Gibson's with this design? Can it be used to date Love Rock's?

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Augustin ']
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2001 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob,
Well, here's some more info for you. Like you, that's the first bolt on neck Les Paul I've seen like that. As for the headstock..mine also has the headstock like the blue one in the pic. Instead of a deep V at the middle of the open book. It goes down shallow..then comes back up in a little V. I know mine is at least from the very early 80's. The guy I bought it from owned it for 20 years. I think this may just be more confusion for up. By the way, does anyone remeber the "lawsuit" feature in Vintage Guitar mag a while ago? I have thrown my copy away. This could hold a lot of info for us.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Barry Plows']
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2001 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rob,
Well, here's some more info for you. Like you, that's the first bolt on neck Les Paul I've seen like that. As for the headstock..mine also has the headstock like the blue one in the pic. Instead of a deep V at the middle of the open book. It goes down shallow..then comes back up in a little V. I know mine is at least from the very early 80's. The guy I bought it from owned it for 20 years. I think this may just be more confusion for up. By the way, does anyone remeber the "lawsuit" feature in Vintage Guitar mag a while ago? I have thrown my copy away. This could hold a lot of info for us.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Barry Plows']
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2001 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tokai's are crap. Copies. Waste your money. You might as well buy a Washburn!

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Dude']
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