supreme
Well-known member
A few things have happened since the original thread was locked and I was asked to open a new thread by ned. Please don't talk about the persons on this forum, but about the topic if you want. You can also ignore this thread.
This is the original thread with more info and pictures:
http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=5954
First, I wanted my Made in Korea Sheraton back with the 200 pounds paid on top but it was gone instantly....which doesn't surprise me because it was flawless, everything was OK and in mint condition. I needed a guitar with a heavier rock sound, so that is why I traded it in, it was a killer blues/jazz machine.
So that is not an option anymore sadly.
Second, the cheaper Goldtop I got offered was also unacceptable, I had mentioned to Bob Murdoch (the UK importer who tried to find a replacement) as a last resort a SAME VALUE Goldtop with humbuckers would be OK, if there were no Customs. The Goldtop offered is cheaper, so I asked the shop owner on May 31 for a set of strings, a strap and speedknobs with the Goldtop to fill in the price gap.....he didn't accept it or rather didn't reply to that email to date. So that deal was off too.
Yesterday I got offered 400 pounds by the shop owner to settle it and never mention anything anymore.......which is a pathetic offer as far as I am concerned. Considering also he never answered the questions about the lies which I asked about many times....he said he would reply to them some other time.....never did.
I have tried to solve it fair and civilized for more than 2 weeks now, but I got ignored so here are the details of his shop:
Tim Muddiman
Music Market
71-73 Kettering road
Northampton
nn1 4aw
uk
I was told on the phone by Tim (who seems to be an official Tokai dealer because he sells many new Tokais, so not just a shop who happened to have one Tokai) that the Tokai was new (true, it was unplayed, no play-wear) and had no issues (lie, it had many flaws as you can see on the pics, more flaws than any guitar I have ever seen). Most importantly I was told it also played OK and even a performing friend tested it and was very impressed according to Tim (the guitar played awful and at normal action frets rattle, strings buzz and get muffled....I think something was wrong with both the frets, nut and probably the neck and 2 shops that inspected it said a similar thing). This phone conversation with Tim made me decide to go ahead with the deal because he sounded sincere, trustworthy and not like he was lying.
To me this is the most important thing after sound (which was OK)....the way it plays and stays in tune, if that had been OK, I actually would not have cared about the many cosmetic issues (eventhough still unacceptable and reason enough to send it back).
I confronted him many times about the lies, asking him to answer all those questions......he never answered them saying he would reply later, blablabla. He was not helpfull in solving this at all, in fact he intentionally stalled things, the way I see it.
Like I said, I let 2 respectable shops inspect the guitar and they both said that at least a few issues (like binding and color marks) were already there BEFORE the final finish was sprayed over the guitar. It would be ludicrous to say that they were the result of play-wear. The cuts alongside a few frets were the result of bad cutting and the holes in the left upper corner of at least 5 inlays could not be the result of play-wear either. Just in case some would want to suggest it was probably a used guitar.....again, there was no playwear whatsoever when I received the guitar.
Probably this week, maybe next week, I am also going to let a professional guitar tech inspect it and document all the flaws (which will cost me money of course). When I have the document I will post the scan of it here.
*See next post for the last part which will appear in 1 minute because I am now copy/pasting what I typed out the last 2 hours*
This is the original thread with more info and pictures:
http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=5954
First, I wanted my Made in Korea Sheraton back with the 200 pounds paid on top but it was gone instantly....which doesn't surprise me because it was flawless, everything was OK and in mint condition. I needed a guitar with a heavier rock sound, so that is why I traded it in, it was a killer blues/jazz machine.
So that is not an option anymore sadly.
Second, the cheaper Goldtop I got offered was also unacceptable, I had mentioned to Bob Murdoch (the UK importer who tried to find a replacement) as a last resort a SAME VALUE Goldtop with humbuckers would be OK, if there were no Customs. The Goldtop offered is cheaper, so I asked the shop owner on May 31 for a set of strings, a strap and speedknobs with the Goldtop to fill in the price gap.....he didn't accept it or rather didn't reply to that email to date. So that deal was off too.
Yesterday I got offered 400 pounds by the shop owner to settle it and never mention anything anymore.......which is a pathetic offer as far as I am concerned. Considering also he never answered the questions about the lies which I asked about many times....he said he would reply to them some other time.....never did.
I have tried to solve it fair and civilized for more than 2 weeks now, but I got ignored so here are the details of his shop:
Tim Muddiman
Music Market
71-73 Kettering road
Northampton
nn1 4aw
uk
I was told on the phone by Tim (who seems to be an official Tokai dealer because he sells many new Tokais, so not just a shop who happened to have one Tokai) that the Tokai was new (true, it was unplayed, no play-wear) and had no issues (lie, it had many flaws as you can see on the pics, more flaws than any guitar I have ever seen). Most importantly I was told it also played OK and even a performing friend tested it and was very impressed according to Tim (the guitar played awful and at normal action frets rattle, strings buzz and get muffled....I think something was wrong with both the frets, nut and probably the neck and 2 shops that inspected it said a similar thing). This phone conversation with Tim made me decide to go ahead with the deal because he sounded sincere, trustworthy and not like he was lying.
To me this is the most important thing after sound (which was OK)....the way it plays and stays in tune, if that had been OK, I actually would not have cared about the many cosmetic issues (eventhough still unacceptable and reason enough to send it back).
I confronted him many times about the lies, asking him to answer all those questions......he never answered them saying he would reply later, blablabla. He was not helpfull in solving this at all, in fact he intentionally stalled things, the way I see it.
Like I said, I let 2 respectable shops inspect the guitar and they both said that at least a few issues (like binding and color marks) were already there BEFORE the final finish was sprayed over the guitar. It would be ludicrous to say that they were the result of play-wear. The cuts alongside a few frets were the result of bad cutting and the holes in the left upper corner of at least 5 inlays could not be the result of play-wear either. Just in case some would want to suggest it was probably a used guitar.....again, there was no playwear whatsoever when I received the guitar.
Probably this week, maybe next week, I am also going to let a professional guitar tech inspect it and document all the flaws (which will cost me money of course). When I have the document I will post the scan of it here.
*See next post for the last part which will appear in 1 minute because I am now copy/pasting what I typed out the last 2 hours*