whats the difference...
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Paladin2019
Well-known member
Nowt. Just increased list price due to inflation, and the name.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Only two difference - new pickups (cables with braid shielding) and more deep neck installation (declared 
)
And frankly speaking when I compared my LS85Q (2002) with LS85Q (June 2003), last one was better - more sustain, less noise, of course maybe just this exact axe was better, but.....
)And frankly speaking when I compared my LS85Q (2002) with LS85Q (June 2003), last one was better - more sustain, less noise, of course maybe just this exact axe was better, but.....
Paladin2019
Well-known member
Oh. Guess I was wrong then. :lol:
ArthurS
Well-known member
My 2003 LS80F has 'normal' yellow/green/black electricity cables running from the pickups, not the 'metal-breaded' cables that the original Gibson PAFs had. Is your LS85Q different (my pickups are supposed to be the Gotoh Mk2's)?
The neck set on my LS80F is the 'intermediate length', which means that it is visible from the pickup cavity, but doesn't protrude in it like the long neck tenons (I can make a picture if desired). As far as I know, the LS70F has a similar neck set.
The neck set on my LS80F is the 'intermediate length', which means that it is visible from the pickup cavity, but doesn't protrude in it like the long neck tenons (I can make a picture if desired). As far as I know, the LS70F has a similar neck set.
Paladin2019
Well-known member
Any chance of posting that neck tenon pic? I'd like to know what the differences are.
Ta
Ta
ArthurS
Well-known member
Thanks for the confirmation, Luis
I'm afraid I can't post the pic of the neck tenon on my LS80. I tried removing the neck pickup yesterday, but it seems one of the screws that holds the pickup ring is 'screwed' - probably because of me when I last removed it. Anway, I couldn't get it out without breaking the pickup ring, and I'd rather wait with that until I have to (ie. when/if I decide to get new pickups).
Anyway, I've found a picture of an LS80F neck fit here on the forum (remembered a thread about it):
The image is upside-down, so the neck is below in the picture. You can just see the end of the neck at the top of the pickup cavity. The longest tenons (like the Gibson Historics) also fill part of the 'tongue' that is routed right behind the end of the neck. In other words, there the neck tenon is also a (small) part of the bottom of the pickup cavity.
I'm afraid I can't post the pic of the neck tenon on my LS80. I tried removing the neck pickup yesterday, but it seems one of the screws that holds the pickup ring is 'screwed' - probably because of me when I last removed it. Anway, I couldn't get it out without breaking the pickup ring, and I'd rather wait with that until I have to (ie. when/if I decide to get new pickups).
Anyway, I've found a picture of an LS80F neck fit here on the forum (remembered a thread about it
):
The image is upside-down, so the neck is below in the picture. You can just see the end of the neck at the top of the pickup cavity. The longest tenons (like the Gibson Historics) also fill part of the 'tongue' that is routed right behind the end of the neck. In other words, there the neck tenon is also a (small) part of the bottom of the pickup cavity.
kherman
Well-known member
Here's an example of the Gibson
Production tenon and Historic tenon.
It's Common for Japan made LP replicas to have the inbetween style tenon. I call it an extended tenon. The tenon goes right up to the PU cavity but does not have the tongue extending into the bottom of the cavity like a Historic.
Just like ArthuerS's Tokai pic. My Diodati is the same way.
http://f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/[email protected]/lst?&.dir=/My+Documents-Diodati+59Q&.src=ph&.begin=9999&.view=t&.order=&.done=http%3a//f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/[email protected]/lst%3f%26.dir=/My%2bDocuments-Diodati%2b59Q%26.src=ph%26.view=t
Kent
Production tenon and Historic tenon.
It's Common for Japan made LP replicas to have the inbetween style tenon. I call it an extended tenon. The tenon goes right up to the PU cavity but does not have the tongue extending into the bottom of the cavity like a Historic.
Just like ArthuerS's Tokai pic. My Diodati is the same way.
http://f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/[email protected]/lst?&.dir=/My+Documents-Diodati+59Q&.src=ph&.begin=9999&.view=t&.order=&.done=http%3a//f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/[email protected]/lst%3f%26.dir=/My%2bDocuments-Diodati%2b59Q%26.src=ph%26.view=t
Kent
Kherman,
Your pictures are very interesting, but the upper photo shows a somewhat convex face on the neck tenon suggesting a less than perfect fit to the neck pocket and potential alignment problems. Is it really as bad as it appears?
Bobw
Your pictures are very interesting, but the upper photo shows a somewhat convex face on the neck tenon suggesting a less than perfect fit to the neck pocket and potential alignment problems. Is it really as bad as it appears?
Bobw
Ian Harvey
Well-known member
Hi Folk!
Hope you don't mind a complete Tokai newbie jumping in mid-stream.
With regard to the curved mating surface of the Gibson Std tenon, I seem to remember the conversation on the Les Paul forum as concluding that it's a cheaper and easier way for Gibson to get the neck-to-body angle correct, and one of the main reasons why so many of them go for the Historic models as there is apparently a noticable difference in tone.
Great forum, by the way. I'm enjoying reading the threads here.
Just bought new a Love Rock ALS80F in Matte Violin Finish last week. Lovely guitar. Looks exactly like ArthurS's. Until the Gibson bell-shaped truss rod cover arrives anyway.
On the subject of 'upgrades' - can anyone point me to a suitable pickguard for this guitar (thinking about fit and correct cream colour)? I've always thought that a Les Paul is naked without one, though I have to say that I'm beginning to veer to the other side, having had this beautiful Tokai in my hands for a week!
Best wishes,
Ian
Hope you don't mind a complete Tokai newbie jumping in mid-stream.
With regard to the curved mating surface of the Gibson Std tenon, I seem to remember the conversation on the Les Paul forum as concluding that it's a cheaper and easier way for Gibson to get the neck-to-body angle correct, and one of the main reasons why so many of them go for the Historic models as there is apparently a noticable difference in tone.
Great forum, by the way. I'm enjoying reading the threads here.
Just bought new a Love Rock ALS80F in Matte Violin Finish last week. Lovely guitar. Looks exactly like ArthurS's. Until the Gibson bell-shaped truss rod cover arrives anyway.
On the subject of 'upgrades' - can anyone point me to a suitable pickguard for this guitar (thinking about fit and correct cream colour)? I've always thought that a Les Paul is naked without one, though I have to say that I'm beginning to veer to the other side, having had this beautiful Tokai in my hands for a week!
Best wishes,
Ian
A
Anonymous
Guest
null
Ian,
The curved surface as you say would help with getting the correct neck angle for reasonable action etc. but the acoustic coupling would be poor owing to limited neck/body contact. All of which dispels the myth that a glued in neck must be 'better' than a bolt on for sustain etc.
Bobw
The curved surface as you say would help with getting the correct neck angle for reasonable action etc. but the acoustic coupling would be poor owing to limited neck/body contact. All of which dispels the myth that a glued in neck must be 'better' than a bolt on for sustain etc.
Bobw
Paladin2019
Well-known member
If the intermediates have that tongue-shaped hole at the base of the tenon, how do you tell the difference between long and middle?
kherman
Well-known member
Paladin2019 said:
Oh you can tell when the tongue extends into the pu cavity.
It's not a perfectly tight fit at the end. you can tell they are two seperate pieces of wood. I've never seen one that you couldnt tell.
as far as the Rocker (what I call it!) tenon on the Production Gibby's.
My understanding is that it's done that way so they can allign the neck to the angle of the body carve.
So, the neck is not attached already when the start to do the final carving of the top.
Where as, my understanding, is that the original 50's LP's had the neck tightly fitted in place, then the top was final carved and sanded to match the neck angle.
More accurate and time consuming process. I believe the Historics are done this same way today.
kherman
Well-known member
Also, as you can see on Gibson Historic tenons the end is not rounded.
So it's real easy to spot.
So it's real easy to spot.
Paladin2019
Well-known member
Cheers chaps. Always good to know about these things. 8)
ArthurS
Well-known member
Congrats on a great guitar! I hope you enjoy yours as much as I do mine. Oh and enjoy that matte finish while it lasts - I've had mine since May/June and the neck is now a near-perfect full shine (shame as it seems to have slowed the neck down a tiny bit). Same goes for some of the body's "contact areas". I don't mind though, gives the guitar character 8)Ian Harvey said:Just bought new a Love Rock ALS80F in Matte Violin Finish last week. Lovely guitar. Looks exactly like ArthurS's. Until the Gibson bell-shaped truss rod cover arrives anyway.
Ian Harvey
Well-known member
Thanks ArthurS. I certainly am enjoying it.
Like, I suspect, many folks on the forum, I enjoy the aesthetics and workmanship as well as the playability and sound of guitars. And this one is the bees knees in all areas.
Talking of the matte finish - do you happen to know what kind of finish it actually is? It's way thinner than the poly on my Epi LP Cust, and also much thinner than the nitro on my USA '57 RI Strat. In fact, it's like there is no finish at all - just some wax polish and elbow grease.
BTW - the truss rod cover arrived. I actually got a Kluson-branded one when I bought the guitar, but it's so badly made that I couldn't bear to fit it. The Gibson one is far better quality.
Any suggestions for the pick guard?
Best wishes,
Ian
Like, I suspect, many folks on the forum, I enjoy the aesthetics and workmanship as well as the playability and sound of guitars. And this one is the bees knees in all areas.
Talking of the matte finish - do you happen to know what kind of finish it actually is? It's way thinner than the poly on my Epi LP Cust, and also much thinner than the nitro on my USA '57 RI Strat. In fact, it's like there is no finish at all - just some wax polish and elbow grease.
BTW - the truss rod cover arrived. I actually got a Kluson-branded one when I bought the guitar, but it's so badly made that I couldn't bear to fit it. The Gibson one is far better quality.
Any suggestions for the pick guard?
Best wishes,
Ian
fasthurricane
Member
Anybody know which, if any, vintage Tokai 'Pauls featured the 'extended tenon'?
thanks,
JB
thanks,
JB
