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leadguitar_323
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Joined: 14 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 4:21 pm    Post subject: Seen These? Reply with quote

Looks like Tokai may be going back to a fender style scratch plate for their strats...

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/traditional/ast33.html





Mick
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so many guitars....so little money...


Last edited by leadguitar_323 on Fri Nov 13, 2009 7:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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njnall
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Joined: 03 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's also these
http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ast70.html [url]
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well that's a step in the right direction. I wonder which countries they will be able to sell them in?

Mike
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Special K
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has anyone bought/played/owned this (basswood) series? I'm curious about the build. Might these be like MIM Fenders, or more likely the Fender Squier line. My guess is they are better.
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JVsearch
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stratman323 wrote:
I wonder which countries they will be able to sell them in?


As long as they don't use the Fender headstock design they can sell them anywhere.
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Diamond
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My MIJ 62 RI in basswood is the coolest Strat I've ever owned...I love basswood, so do John Suhr, James Tyler, even the Ibanez JS1200 is basswood.
It's a great guitar wood, IMO.

Those ST33 models look like great bargains, I'm assuming at that price they must be made in China, and the ST70 in Japan?


Last edited by Diamond on Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Diamond
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Last edited by Diamond on Sat Nov 14, 2009 4:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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greco_burst
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Telecasters looking good too

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ate76b.html

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ate70.html

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ate78.html
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leadguitar_323
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote







AST-70 and new Tele.

Mick
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Diamond
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got to have them.
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JVsearch wrote:
As long as they don't use the Fender headstock design they can sell them anywhere.


Is it only the headstock shape that is covered by copyright? I thought Fender had some sort of rights to the scratchplate shape & the body shape (silhouette) as well?
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Diamond wrote:
My MIJ 62 RI in basswood is the coolest Strat I've ever owned...I love basswood, so do John Suhr, James Tyler, even the Ibanez JS1200 is basswood.
It's a great guitar wood, IMO.

Those ST33 models look like great bargains, I'm assuming at that price they must be made in China, and the ST70 in Japan?


Well I respect your opinion but I don't agree with you. I think this is why I've always preferred Tokais to many of the early Fender Japans - using alder or sen gives a more "authentic" vintage Strat/Tele tone than basswood does, & that's what I like. I think my 80s MIJ Tele is basswood - the two sen Tokais I now own are streets ahead in authentic Tele sound terms.

Basswood makes a decent guitar, but it's more of a modern mid-rangey sound - to me alder & sen/ash are the best woods for vintage copies.
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Jay Low
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Joined: 14 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi everyone, there's a new kid in town...

Actually, this "unauthentic scratchplate thing" of Tokai strats was a new thing for me before I started to visit this site last summer. Has it been like that for a long a time?

Here in Finland Tokai strats have had f-style scratchplate all the time:
http://www.musamaailma.fi/epages/musa.sf/en_GB/?ObjectID=113050&ViewAction=View&PageSize=20

I have a AST-50 w/ maple neck ('57 specs I suppose) from 2005, fantastic guitar!!!
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JVsearch
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stratman323 wrote:
JVsearch wrote:
As long as they don't use the Fender headstock design they can sell them anywhere.


Is it only the headstock shape that is covered by copyright? I thought Fender had some sort of rights to the scratchplate shape & the body shape (silhouette) as well?


AFAIK it's a grey area about the scratchplate because it wasn't tested in court, but ownership of the body shape has been lost by Gibson and most likely by Fender too. The law suit was about a LP type copy and it was decided that Gibson only had ownership of the open book headstock (and their logo of course). The body shape was said to be too vague for someone to own because if you think about it the LP resembles several other earlier guitars, and there wasn't anything specific about the shape that didn't derive from trying to make an ergonomically shaped guitar. If the LP didn't have a cut away it would have looked like a small acoustic guitar shape that were already common. So the body shape was said to be already in the public domain. Another factor was the length of time that had passed before they tried to assert their rights - too long.

Fender might have a slightly stronger case for their Strat body (no hope for the Tele shape) but I doubt they'd get anywhere, it's just been too long and it's well accepted that most guitars have a rounded butt with a curve to balance it on your knee as well as fit against your body, and cutaway(s) to allow upper fret access. As this is what anybody would be trying to do, and already had been doing, when making an electric guitar it would be grossly unfair to allow one company to own these features as their "design".

The headstocks, on the other hand, are pure visual design - you don't need a Fender or Gibson shaped headstock to make a guitar, it makes no difference whatsoever to the ergonomics or tone of the guitar.

**Edit - in fact Fender have just lost an appeal earlier this year over the Strat body shape, it was held to be SO common in the guitar building business that it was generic. Unfair? Not really, but Fender should have protected their design worldwide from day one and there'd be no issue today, but it was a simpler and more innocent time back then. Also protecting it would have cost a lot and maybe the prices of their guitars would have been higher thus allowing a competitor to get ahead of them, and maybe something else would have ended up as the icon?!
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Dave_Mc
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

greco_burst wrote:
Telecasters looking good too

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ate76b.html

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ate70.html

http://www1.odn.ne.jp/tokaigakki/products/vintage/ate78.html


sweet Hopefully they'll get them over here soon, and hopefully they'll not be about ?800 with the current exchange rate.

EDIT: is there a colour scheme key anywhere? I had a quick look but couldn't find anything, some of the abbreviations are fairly obvious, but some aren't...
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