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True bypass - Tone suckers?

 
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JohnA
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Joined: 02 Mar 2007
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Location: Leicester UK

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:36 am    Post subject: True bypass - Tone suckers? Reply with quote

Never really been one to use pedals, but I'm back in a band after along lay-off and finding for some songs,even though a guitar in to a crankes JTM-45 sound great, a bit of variation in my basic sound is required so I've dug out the old pedalboard!

Convinced that my pedals must be sucking some tone, I've just bought a Kelley looper so when required I can take all my pedal out of the chain and capture the glorious sound of my guitar straight in to the amp

So after hours of re-routing patch-leads to incorporate the looper in to my pedal board it came to test time. All pedals switched off but still in the signal chain, I wound up the amp and played for a while then stood on the looper to take the pedals out and........just sounds the same to me:(

Anyone else with a similar experience? Is 'true bypass' for better tone a myth?
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't even know which of my pedals has "true bypass"! I only barely know what it is!

Mike
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Dave_Mc
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

what leads are you using, and how long are they? i guess it also depends on how good the bypass/buffer is in your non-true bypass pedals... as i understand it (which is not terribly well) buffered is better for some situations, buffered for others...
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JohnA
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Using quality Klotz cables with Neutrik plugs about 3m long.

After a bit more experimenting I can hear a difference in tone if I back off the guitar's volume, it's subtle, but definetely there, and does sound better with the pedals bypassed.

I do use the volume a lot when I play, so perhaps the looper will improve my tone a bit, not so anyone would ever notice in a live situation, but at leas I know
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leadguitar_323
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good luck with the new band mate, as we say here,"go hard or go home".....

Mick
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JohnA
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Location: Leicester UK

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

leadguitar_323 wrote:
Good luck with the new band mate, as we say here,"go hard or go home".....

Mick


Cheers Mick!! A going well so far, nice buch of guys, great players, and good songs. Best of all they really like my playing so I can just be me
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JohnA wrote:
Best of all they really like my playing so I can just be me


And I bet they don't give a toss about whether your pedals are true bypass!

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throstur
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Joined: 28 Aug 2008
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Location: Reykjavik, Iceland

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey John, congrats on your new band

3 or 4 quality pedals do not suck much tone IMHO, and many good pedals ARE true bypass anyway. However, if you hook up 5-10 production pedals and hook'em up with one transformer on a daisychain IT WILL SUCK your tone bigtime, and you will get a flow of mud. Wah pedals are tone suckers and so is the Boss TU-2 stage tuner. It is possible to put true bypass in most Wah's and buy a relatively cheap True Bypass box with Tuner Out.

By the way, True bypass means that you route the signal "around" the pedal and the signal is not affected in any way by any components of the pedal.
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JohnA
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stratman323 wrote:
JohnA wrote:
Best of all they really like my playing so I can just be me


And I bet they don't give a toss about whether your pedals are true bypass!



They had better care!! all this tone-chasing has been done for their listening pleasure!!
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JohnA
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

throstur wrote:
Hey John, congrats on your new band

3 or 4 quality pedals do not suck much tone IMHO, and many good pedals ARE true bypass anyway. However, if you hook up 5-10 production pedals and hook'em up with one transformer on a daisychain IT WILL SUCK your tone bigtime, and you will get a flow of mud. Wah pedals are tone suckers and so is the Boss TU-2 stage tuner. It is possible to put true bypass in most Wah's and buy a relatively cheap True Bypass box with Tuner Out.

By the way, True bypass means that you route the signal "around" the pedal and the signal is not affected in any way by any components of the pedal.


The way I have set my board up is so my true-bypass pedals are in-line and all my cheapies and tuner are in thye loop. I do intend to add to my pedal collection so this set-up should prove worthwhile in the long-term!
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Dave_Mc
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JohnA wrote:
Using quality Klotz cables with Neutrik plugs about 3m long.

After a bit more experimenting I can hear a difference in tone if I back off the guitar's volume, it's subtle, but definetely there, and does sound better with the pedals bypassed.

I do use the volume a lot when I play, so perhaps the looper will improve my tone a bit, not so anyone would ever notice in a live situation, but at leas I know


yeah, if you can hear a little difference it's probably worth it. i recently upgraded my cables to cleartones, and the difference was pretty huge, but i haven't tried comparing my true bypass pedals to the buffered ones, as i don't have a true bypass box which you have, and there'd be too many variables to be able to make a sweeping statement without something like that...
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Paladin2019
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Joined: 06 Sep 2002
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Location: Cardiff, UK

PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got a similar setup: true bypass in line, then three buffered fx in the amp's loop running via a true bypass box.

The difference with the bypass box is minor but definately audible and the effect becomes more noticeable depending on, for example, volume or gain levels. Also if you add more buffered pedals you will lose more high end so it's good future-proofing
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