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nitro ,,, or poly ... again again ,,,,,???????
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muccaz
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Joined: 12 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 2:06 am    Post subject: nitro ,,, or poly ... again again ,,,,,??????? Reply with quote

hi
i have a burny FLG 90 i got from burny123 ,,,, i live in denmark too .....
but i can not see how this i in nitro ,,,,,,, i have used acetone to test it ,,,,, but with no luck ....... i think is is painted in nitro ,,,,, but then had a poly on the top .... when i test it in the pickup cavity it works .... but not anyware else ......
on my fender 57us ri from 87 ..... it works .... the paint gets like glue .......anyware on the body
i have try to test my other guitars i got 30 now ... all old mij from the 80
greco burny washburn fender jv ibanez fender sq
but the same if it works .....it only works in the pickup cavity
i hope i am doing some thing wrong ........
please help me
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20 century boy
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

there's almost no Burny with nitro finish.

And only a few high ends...
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Ikkyu
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have an FLG90 too and it should be nitro. You can tell from the fact the finish is not so shiny.
Anyway if you'd ever think to sell your guitar let me know
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MIJvintage
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 7:33 am    Post subject: Re: nitro ,,, or poly ... again again ,,,,,??????? Reply with quote

muccaz wrote:

i have used acetone to test it ,,,,, but with no luck ....... i think is is painted in nitro ,,,,, but then had a poly on the top .... when i test it in the pickup cavity it works .... but not anyware else ......


I know it must be frustrating trying to determine this but if it were me, I would be OK just knowing that there was a positive reaction for nitro, even if it was only in the pup routes

Personally, I wouldn't attempt the procedure in any other location, or in other words where the finish is visible
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muccaz
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: nitro ,,, or poly ... again again ,,,,,??????? Reply with quote

MIJvintage wrote:
muccaz wrote:

i have used acetone to test it ,,,,, but with no luck ....... i think is is painted in nitro ,,,,, but then had a poly on the top .... when i test it in the pickup cavity it works .... but not anyware else ......


I know it must be frustrating trying to determine this but if it were me, I would be OK just knowing that there was a positive reaction for nitro, even if it was only in the pup routes

Personally, I wouldn't attempt the procedure in any other location, or in other words where the finish is visible


hi
yes i know ... but if if i try in the pickup cavity ,,,, or the control cavity ,,,,, about 50 % of my guitar is nitro then .......... and i own a 79 ibanez blazer and a fender bullet from 80 refinished in black nitro ,,,, and a 57 us ri from 87 ,,,,, wher it works ,,,,,, the paint gets like glue ,,,,,,,
but on my flg 90 ....... nothing ,,,,,,, and i mean nothing i have tryed every thing to get it to work ....... only in the pickup cavity ,,,,,,,,, but then it is not nitro ,,,,,,, most be poly overcoat then ,,,,,,,,,,,,

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stratman323
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard of a poly sealant coat under a nitro top coat - Fender do this on the newer USRIs (not the 80s ones like yours and mine, thankfully), but I can't say I've heard of a poly top coat on a nitro undercoat - why would any manufacturer do that?

I've never bothered trying to dissolve the finishes on my guitars with acetone, I can tell by the feel of the neck if it's nitro or poly. To me it makes a big difference to how comfortable the neck feels in my hand. If you can't tell the difference by the feel, I would respectfully suggest that it clearly doesn't matter to you, so you shouldn't worry about it. And you're lucky - you can buy poly finished guitars, and save yourself quite a bit of money!

If I ever bought a decent nitro finished guitar (like a Fender USRI, or an ST80), and I found that the pickup cavities had been ruined by someone deliberately trying to dissolve the finish, I would be distinctly unhappy about them ruining my new guitar.

Mike
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muccaz
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stratman323 wrote:
I've heard of a poly sealant coat under a nitro top coat - Fender do this on the newer USRIs (not the 80s ones like yours and mine, thankfully), but I can't say I've heard of a poly top coat on a nitro undercoat - why would any manufacturer do that?

I've never bothered trying to dissolve the finishes on my guitars with acetone, I can tell by the feel of the neck if it's nitro or poly. To me it makes a big difference to how comfortable the neck feels in my hand. If you can't tell the difference by the feel, I would respectfully suggest that it clearly doesn't matter to you, so you shouldn't worry about it. And you're lucky - you can buy poly finished guitars, and save yourself quite a bit of money!

If I ever bought a decent nitro finished guitar (like a Fender USRI, or an ST80), and I found that the pickup cavities had been ruined by someone deliberately trying to dissolve the finish, I would be distinctly unhappy about them ruining my new guitar.

Mike

hi
yes i know what you mean ,,,,,,,, and i think i know how nitro feels like ,,,,, and my flg 90 .... does not feel like nitro ....... but every body says it is nitro ,,,,,,,,,, nitro on my 87 strat looks like the paint is in the wood ,,,,,,, but on my flg 90 .... it looks to new and shiny to me ........

and i would never ruin a good guitar ,,,,, dont worry ,,,,, just a very small spot ,,,,, you can not see it ............
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leadguitar_323
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2008 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi all, I'm pretty sure that you cannot put poly over nitro, the thinner in the poly reacts badly with the nitro, i think , like Mike said , its usually done the other way round.......poly with nitro top coat....

Mick
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bobwise
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if Armor All or other similar silicone treatments could form a barrier that protects nitro from acetone? Even trace amounts of silicone on an old finish will cause new nitro to develop "fish eyes" if you spray it on top of the old. If a previous owner frequently sprayed it with silicone, some of it would be absorbed into the nitro and sink in, maybe enough to form a layer that would need to be saturated with acetone for a prolonged period before dissolving. Since it's unlikely the previous owner would have sprayed the pickup and control cavities, those areas would still be vulnerable to acetone.

There are some solvent-resistant finishes that can be sprayed over nitro. Rickenbacker uses "conversion varnish" which is a catalyst cured poly-type finish and sometimes use nitro as a color coat under the CV (rarely -- for most of colors, the color coats are also CV). But if they had top coated your guitar they most likely would have sprayed the top coat in the pickup and control cavities too.
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muccaz
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobwise wrote:
I wonder if Armor All or other similar silicone treatments could form a barrier that protects nitro from acetone? Even trace amounts of silicone on an old finish will cause new nitro to develop "fish eyes" if you spray it on top of the old. If a previous owner frequently sprayed it with silicone, some of it would be absorbed into the nitro and sink in, maybe enough to form a layer that would need to be saturated with acetone for a prolonged period before dissolving. Since it's unlikely the previous owner would have sprayed the pickup and control cavities, those areas would still be vulnerable to acetone.

There are some solvent-resistant finishes that can be sprayed over nitro. Rickenbacker uses "conversion varnish" which is a catalyst cured poly-type finish and sometimes use nitro as a color coat under the CV (rarely -- for most of colors, the color coats are also CV). But if they had top coated your guitar they most likely would have sprayed the top coat in the pickup and control cavities too.


hi
thanks .....for the info ........ i must be in nitro then ,,,,,,,, i must be doing something wrong ,,,,,,,,
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3pupLPC
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

so the comment has been made that very few Burny's were nitro, only some high-ends... but is there a way to generalize models that "may" be nitro vs. those that are definitely not?
BTW, I have a thin-poly BurnyLPC that is sweet, so I do not really have a bias other than historical accuracy...
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muccaz
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

3pupLPC wrote:
so the comment has been made that very few Burny's were nitro, only some high-ends... but is there a way to generalize models that "may" be nitro vs. those that are definitely not?
BTW, I have a thin-poly BurnyLPC that is sweet, so I do not really have a bias other than historical accuracy...


hi

now i got it to work ...... the acetone must be on the guitar for some time and then it begins to work ,,,, like it gets more white ,,,,,,, my greco eg super real with chambered body is also in nitro ,,,, to my big surprice ,,,, i just need some time to work ,,,,
all the best otto
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japanstrat
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 3:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muccaz, do you know what model the nitro chambered Greco is?
My EG500? Tobacco Greco Super Real is one of the first Super Reals, made in December 1979 and has a 3 piece top and real MOP and fret edge binding. It has finish problems on the neck where a guitar stand might have touched the neck. I know guitar stands can do this sort of damage to nitro. I always thought the lower end Grecos were poly but I'm having doubts about that especially for the EG500 up to the EG800 models from 1979-1982. Maybe some of the EG500-EG800 models were nitro.
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muccaz
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

japanstrat wrote:
Muccaz, do you know what model the nitro chambered Greco is?
My EG500? Tobacco Greco Super Real is one of the first Super Reals, made in December 1979 and has a 3 piece top and real MOP and fret edge binding. It has finish problems on the neck where a guitar stand might have touched the neck. I know guitar stands can do this sort of damage to nitro. I always thought the lower end Grecos were poly but I'm having doubts about that especially for the EG500 up to the EG800 models from 1979-1982. Maybe some of the EG500-EG800 models were nitro.


hi
yes ..... just like you said .....a lot off small marks on the neck from the stand , and thin layer off paint ,,,,,, 2 piece top .... ink serial ...... greco deluxe turners ,,,,,, dowel neck ... pick up with 200121 ,,,, are they u 2000 ??? sound great ...... oil cap and mesh wire ...... the inlays are not a very good fit on the neck a lot off filer ..... a slim 60 neck ,,,,, correct gibson angel on the head ,,,,,, i like it a lot .... great sound and not that heavy ,,,,,,,, i think is is in tobacco not much black in it more redish and yellow ,,,,,,,, maybe tea burst ??

all the best otto
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japanstrat
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 7:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
a lot off small marks on the neck


That's exactly the marks that my Greco has and your Greco has the same marks and yours is nitro when you did the acetone test. I'm not sure about the pickups. Yours is a chambered Super Real with a 2 piece top and nitro finish and I don't think it's in the catalogs. The pickups are probably U-2000 but the number that is stamped on the back of the pickups only gives the year the pickups were made and not the pickups model type.
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