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Vintage '81 Tokai ES150R

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the_man said:
She is a real beauty. However, the asking price is very similar to a 1964 ES335 on ebay 2 days ago.

My max offer would be around USD 1800.--. Thats her value.

I know that I'll get flamed for thtis statement.

Rup

You shouldn't, that's interesting information, if people can't accept that kind of info they should do something else.
 
the_man said:
She is a real beauty. However, the asking price is very similar to a 1964 ES335 on ebay 2 days ago.

My max offer would be around USD 1800.--. Thats her value.

I know that I'll get flamed for thtis statement.

Rup

not flamed, just laughed at..

when you state ''thats her value'' what you mean is that is what you want to pay... nice ploy to try and get the price down.. I think thats a high price, but not crazy high..
 
the_man said:
She is a real beauty. However, the asking price is very similar to a 1964 ES335 on ebay 2 days ago.

My max offer would be around USD 1800.--. Thats her value.

I know that I'll get flamed for thtis statement.

Rup


when anyone states, "Thats her value", that is one opinion & one opinion only

Ultimately, the value is what someone is willing to pay & also, what the owner is willing to take for it

My idea of a minimum valuation would be ~ $2,400 USD
My idea of a maximum valuation would be ~ $3200 USD

The seller's asking price is ~$3700 USD

One should certainly consider the rarity of the item, and also the condition

IMO, your estimation of value of $1800, I believe, is quite low
 
I concur with the masses here, that value of $1800.00 is quite low in my eyes too...

People always hope to get a good deal. It's human nature. Markets fluctuate on some models wildly. Not long ago mid to late 60's ES335 and ES345s were deals, now people have "gotten over" trying to find a 50s version and the prices have drastically gone up on the ES's...

Here's my old (no longer own it) ES150DCN, mid 69 vintage. I got it on 9/11... Yeah, THAT 9/11... I watched the auction like crazy and put in my very first eSnipe bid and got the guitar for, $700.00 !! I could not believe it... The original pickups were gone and it needed new wiring but all in all I put $1200.00 into it (guitar price, Seymour Duncan Antiquities, new wiring and the lovely hand made ebony tailpiece)... Bad thing about these babies is there are some with a lot of finish checking. Mine was like an alligator, sure was sweet playing...

P2160006.jpg


For anyone jonesing for this type of guitar you can find Jay Turser JT142s on eBay for about $300.00... It's a discontinued model so if you see the one you want go for it.

Now a-days the ES150DCs go for about 3k... Back when I got mine the standard going price was about $1500.00 - $1800.00 if it was a blonde, the walnut finished ones are cheaper (and more common).

THE CHERRY ES150DCC - I tell ya I would rather have one of those than an L5... No kidding

I got this around my birthday last year - a Korean built Vantage ES150DCN clone. Maple neck... I got the Gibson ES175 tailpiece and gold knobs and love it. I paid under $300.00 for it. I do want to replace the pickups and wiring at some point. But to sit out on the deck with my old Deluxe Reverb and Dumble pedal this thing is a nice jazz box...

PC040067.jpg
 
hello folks...
thanks for the intense contribution, i also very much appreciate all the various statements - that's O.K.! also, the simple fact is - America is still the "BUYERS-PARADISE" -
however, i have never seen, even nowadays in these times of money-crisis, the '64-ES guitar for less than maybe 6 - 8.000,00 $ usually more - even the "Clapton-copy" sells for 8 - 10.000,00 $...
also, thanks Villager & MIJvintage - your statements are 100% right: "the value is what someone is willing to pay" - add. "and diamonds are nothing else than pressed carbon !"
finally - one more idea for the pickguard discussion, i.e. "long" or "short" - no pickguard doesn't look that bad either...


es150r_07.2.jpg
 
bigmike said:
I concur with the masses here, that value of $1800.00 is quite low in my eyes too...

People always hope to get a good deal. It's human nature. Markets fluctuate on some models wildly. Not long ago mid to late 60's ES335 and ES345s were deals, now people have "gotten over" trying to find a 50s version and the prices have drastically gone up on the ES's...

Here's my old (no longer own it) ES150DCN, mid 69 vintage. I got it on 9/11... Yeah, THAT 9/11... I watched the auction like crazy and put in my very first eSnipe bid and got the guitar for, $700.00 !! I could not believe it... The original pickups were gone and it needed new wiring but all in all I put $1200.00 into it (guitar price, Seymour Duncan Antiquities, new wiring and the lovely hand made ebony tailpiece)... Bad thing about these babies is there are some with a lot of finish checking. Mine was like an alligator, sure was sweet playing...

P2160006.jpg


For anyone jonesing for this type of guitar you can find Jay Turser JT142s on eBay for about $300.00... It's a discontinued model so if you see the one you want go for it.

Now a-days the ES150DCs go for about 3k... Back when I got mine the standard going price was about $1500.00 - $1800.00 if it was a blonde, the walnut finished ones are cheaper (and more common).

THE CHERRY ES150DCC - I tell ya I would rather have one of those than an L5... No kidding

I got this around my birthday last year - a Korean built Vantage ES150DCN clone. Maple neck... I got the Gibson ES175 tailpiece and gold knobs and love it. I paid under $300.00 for it. I do want to replace the pickups and wiring at some point. But to sit out on the deck with my old Deluxe Reverb and Dumble pedal this thing is a nice jazz box...

PC040067.jpg


Nice! That Vantage is cool too.

Yeah, the value of the ES150DC's has just about doubled over the last few years. Think I paid $1500 several years ago (all original and original hardshell case).

It's my second vintage guitar. My other "nest egg" guitar, a mint 65 Strat is now worth 5 times what I paid for it. Again, not a popular guitar because Fender went to CBS later that year but the 65's with the small headstock and transitional logo are still pre CBS. While everyone was busy buying 62's and 50's strats, the lowley 65 could be snapped up at a decent price. Not any more.
 
Mr.Bob said:
hello folks...
thanks for the intense contribution, i also very much appreciate all the various statements - that's O.K.! also, the simple fact is - America is still the "BUYERS-PARADISE" -
however, i have never seen, even nowadays in these times of money-crisis, the '64-ES guitar for less than maybe 6 - 8.000,00 $ usually more - even the "Clapton-copy" sells for 8 - 10.000,00 $...
also, thanks Villager & MIJvintage - your statements are 100% right: "the value is what someone is willing to pay" - add. "and diamonds are nothing else than pressed carbon !"
finally - one more idea for the pickguard discussion, i.e. "long" or "short" - no pickguard doesn't look that bad either...

That is a lovely ES & if I were in the market for one, I would certainly have a difficult time resisiting this one.
Is that a Brazilian fingerboard?
I actually prefer the short pick guard, as in the first photo of the thread.
The no pickguard look is pretty nice too tho' ................
 
hello MIJvintage...
yes, it's brazilian rosewood - this i've been told by the Tokai man on the "Frankfurt Messe" in 1982 - to my knowledge, Tokai official name was "JACARANDA"...
 
marcusnieman said:
not a popular guitar because Fender went to CBS later that year but the 65's with the small headstock and transitional logo are still pre CBS.

CBS took over Fender from January 1965. Obviously the early CBS guitars were likely to be made up of old parts in stock, but anything dated 1965 onwards is CBS.

So if you don't want it any more Marcus - just ship it over here!
 
stratman323 said:
marcusnieman said:
not a popular guitar because Fender went to CBS later that year but the 65's with the small headstock and transitional logo are still pre CBS.

CBS took over Fender from January 1965. Obviously the early CBS guitars were likely to be made up of old parts in stock, but anything dated 1965 onwards is CBS.

So if you don't want it any more Marcus - just ship it over here!

Right you are. I guess I should have said "went to CBS style production later that year". The early 65's were still considered pre CBS because they were made from old stock and before the CBS cost cutting measures for production were implemented.
 
marcusnieman said:
stratman323 said:
marcusnieman said:
not a popular guitar because Fender went to CBS later that year but the 65's with the small headstock and transitional logo are still pre CBS.

CBS took over Fender from January 1965. Obviously the early CBS guitars were likely to be made up of old parts in stock, but anything dated 1965 onwards is CBS.

So if you don't want it any more Marcus - just ship it over here!

Right you are. I guess I should have said "went to CBS style production later that year". The early 65's were still considered pre CBS because they were made from old stock and before the CBS cost cutting measures for production were implemented.

I believe that Fender was utilizing a stamped dating mark at this time ........... have you ever checked the butt of the neck for a (month) date stamp? ........

like on my old 1966 Fender Electric XII, it was stamped 12 MAR 66, which designated March 1966; the 12 was a reference for model, I believe ...........


EDIT: From 'Vintage Guitar Info'

March 1962 to 1965: Ink stamp in dark blue or red ink below the truss rod adjustment at the butt end of the neck in "XX MMM-YY W" format. The "XX" is not the day of stamping. Instead it is a code for the type of neck (for example, "02"=Stratocaster, "3/4"=3/4 scale Musicmaster). The "W" is the neck width where "A" is the narrowest, "B" is normal, and "C" is the widest.

1966: the model number (the number stamped on the neck before the month) change (for example, "13"=Stratocaster).

For most collectors, pre-CBS (pre-1966) Fender vintage guitars and amps are the desirable ones. Although CBS purchased Fender (officially) on January 3rd 1965, it took some time till the guitars changed (though by mid 1964, six months before CBS bought Fender, things were already "on the way down"). By the end of 1965, the general look and feel of the Fender guitars had changed significantly. All collectors feel the quality of their instruments and amps suffered as CBS employed more "mass production" manufacturing processes to the Fender guitars. The "large peghead" (starting in late 1965) as used on the Fender Stratocaster was one example of the (bad) changes to come.
 
MIJvintage said:
marcusnieman said:
stratman323 said:
marcusnieman said:
not a popular guitar because Fender went to CBS later that year but the 65's with the small headstock and transitional logo are still pre CBS.

CBS took over Fender from January 1965. Obviously the early CBS guitars were likely to be made up of old parts in stock, but anything dated 1965 onwards is CBS.

So if you don't want it any more Marcus - just ship it over here!

Right you are. I guess I should have said "went to CBS style production later that year". The early 65's were still considered pre CBS because they were made from old stock and before the CBS cost cutting measures for production were implemented.

I believe that Fender was utilizing a stamped dating mark at this time ........... have you ever checked the butt of the neck for a (month) date stamp? ........

like on my old 1966 Fender Electric XII, it was stamped 12 MAR 66, which designated March 1966; the 12 was a reference for model, I believe ...........


EDIT: From 'Vintage Guitar Info'

March 1962 to 1965: Ink stamp in dark blue or red ink below the truss rod adjustment at the butt end of the neck in "XX MMM-YY W" format. The "XX" is not the day of stamping. Instead it is a code for the type of neck (for example, "02"=Stratocaster, "3/4"=3/4 scale Musicmaster). The "W" is the neck width where "A" is the narrowest, "B" is normal, and "C" is the widest.

1966: the model number (the number stamped on the neck before the month) change (for example, "13"=Stratocaster).

For most collectors, pre-CBS (pre-1966) Fender vintage guitars and amps are the desirable ones. Although CBS purchased Fender (officially) on January 3rd 1965, it took some time till the guitars changed (though by mid 1964, six months before CBS bought Fender, things were already "on the way down"). By the end of 1965, the general look and feel of the Fender guitars had changed significantly. All collectors feel the quality of their instruments and amps suffered as CBS employed more "mass production" manufacturing processes to the Fender guitars. The "large peghead" (starting in late 1965) as used on the Fender Stratocaster was one example of the (bad) changes to come.

Very informative.......thanks........Mine's stamped 2FEB65 B with an L series serial number, plain neck plate. No "F" on it.
 

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