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Please help a pedals novice
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:19 pm    Post subject: Please help a pedals novice Reply with quote

For years I've preferred to just plug a Strat into my Fender Blues Deluxe amp and work with the sound I get. But, I need more flexibility with the band I'm now in, so I bought an Ibanez Tubescreamer, & I've recently got a Dunlop wah-wah, which is fun.

The problem is that when I have a couple of pedals between my guitar and the amp, I get a noticeable volume drop - is this right? I have to turn up the volume or gain to get the same volume as when I plug straight into the amp.

The second matter is what order should the pedals go in? If I use a Seymour Duncan pickup booster (still not sure if I need this), the Tubescreamer, the wah, and the Fender PT100 tuner, which order should they go in? I was thinking pickup booster, then overdrive, then wah, then tuner, then amp. My amp doesn't seem to have an FX loop.

I'm powering them all with an old Frontline 5 way mains power supply.

The other thing I was thinking about was getting some sort of board to save having to gaffer tape each one to the floor. Any suggestions? I've never really paid attention to these things in the past!

Hope someone can help. Thanks.

Mike
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Stone Free
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Please help a pedals novice Reply with quote

I am not sure what the SD pedal is, so I will leave it out of the equation.

I would place the wah first (get it true-bypassed if you can: big difference with what follows), then tuner, TS and into amp. By the way, you shouldn't experience a (noticeable) volume drop, especially with so few pedals. I can even say that there should be minimal loss of volume. Not sure about what's going on with your rig.

A distortion-type pedal would be a nice addition following the TS (which can be used to boost it for leads if necessary).

The tuners I use (Boss or Peterson, depending on my mood) both kill the signal so I can tune quietly. Also, the Peterson is true-bypass.

Good luck,
James
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twinfan
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 3:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The volume drop is not normal, but Wah's do slice off the top end of your treble which may make your rig appear quieter.

I would hook up your pedals like this:

Guitar -> Wah -> Tuner -> SD Booster -> Tubescreamer -> Amp

Wah's are very sensitive to picking attack and need to be first in the chain. Tuners need to be as early as possible to get a good pure signal so they go next. A general rul with overdrive/distortions is to put them in order of gain. This way you can boost into your tubescreamer with nice results.

Try that order and let us know how you get on
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Ozeshin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the SD is kinda made redundant by the TS....and the other way round .
The Pickup Booster(I own one) is a 3 stage boost.
One stage is best for 'buckers...another for Single coils and the third is a general boost.
I used to use it but it has a wiring issue at the moment and squeals like a stuck pig.
I use a Behringer Booster as a replacement...it cost me a third of the price of the Duncan as does a damn fine job as a solo boost.
ALWAYS place the boost at the END of your signal chain so that you can boost your other effects.
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks all.

Oz, by the end, you mean nearest the guitar? I tend to think of the end as being nearest the amp....
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Ozeshin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nearest the amp mate....a boost needs to the last thing in your signal chain before the amp.
If it goes in front of all your other pedals then you see the problem where rather than boost your signal...the gain stage on the boost/overdrive doesn't have enough grunt to control the signal from the other pedals and you'll find exactly as you did that the volume is cut in half.
I have my setup:
Guitar>Zoom G2>Boost pedal>Amp.
That way I can use whatever patch i like in my multieffects and STILL be able to boost that signal for solos.
If it was the other way around the gain stage on the boost would drop the volume rather than boost it.
And always set the DRIVE setting on your boost/OD at around 3-4 o'clock and THEN use the GAIN/LEVEL setting to select the level of boost for solos.
That way you keep your signal from your amp/effects unit reasonably pure and unaffected by excessive amounts of saturated distortion.
So in short...the tone that we all worked so hard to capture will stay pretty much as you hear it but LOUDER.


Last edited by Ozeshin on Fri Dec 07, 2007 8:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ozeshin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also Behringer make a powered pedal board for around $200(AUD)

And this is the booster i use...amazing quality for a pedal that only costs $35(AUD) brand new
http://www.behringer.com/PB100/index.cfm?lang=eng
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the help guys. Well I changed the order of pedals as recommended, but I still got a noticeable volume drop with all 3 pedals linked up (I didn't bother with the Duncan pedal). Compared to plugging straight into the amp, it's like playing a guitar with much lower output pickups.

And I still don't know why.....
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Outsider
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did someone already mention the powersupply? You might need something with more juice, like Visualsounds OneSpot. Also you probably should try them all out one by one. The tuner as well as the power adaptor both look a little guilty to me. What kind of Dunlop wah you got?

Lots of question very few answers, sorry. But it doesn't seem like a normal situation you only should try to live with. I'm quite sure there's something you can do.
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did wonder about the power supply. Or maybe the extra lenth of lead required could have an effect?

I have a Dunlop GCB-95 wah pedal, if that helps.
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Ozeshin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does the wah pedal have any type of level...volume control?
See...if the Overdrive pedal has a Level/Gain control...and the wah also has a level or Gain control you need to try them one at a time to see which pedal is cutting the volume...my guess?...the Wah.
From my experience if you have 1xguitar+overdrive pedal+amp then that's all you need to boost your signal.
Your signal chain needs to be GUITAR>WAH>OD>AMP.
If the Wah doesn't have ANY type of Gain/level control then that's a problem as anything between your amp and guitar will rely on the effect in between to provide gain.
I found my '80's TS9 yesterday...I'll dust it off and test it out for you....using GUITAR>TS9>AMP and see if it acts well as a solo boost for you.
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, no controls on the wah.....

Now I know why I always used to just plug into the amp
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stratman323
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I bought 2 new patch leads last week, heavier duty ones than the ones I had before. Just got in from rehearsal, and they seem to have cured the noise drop problem. Amazing that a couple of cheap and nasty patch leads could cause such a problem

Looks like we've recruited a keyboard player too, so I'm a happy man tonite
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Ozeshin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I envy you...
I love being in a twin lead guitar setup...but failing that I reckon a keyboard player would be perfect.
My rythym guitarist is barely adequate as a rythym player let alone doing ANY lead work...it's just beyond him totally....frustrating.
In my days in metal bands I ALWAYS had another lead player to trade off and dual leads.
Damn you Mick for living on the point...just rude.
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leadguitar_323
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Oze,Hahahahaha, well you know the livin's pretty good out this way and your Oldies live just down the road, soooooooooo i'll start looking for a house for ya.. .
Cheers Mick
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