• If you have bought, sold or gained information from our Classifieds, please donate to Tokai Forum and give back.

    You can become a Supporting Member or just click here to donate.

Got A Sour Deal From Koiz Guitar

Tokai Forum

Help Support Tokai Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Sad to see all the angst back and forth over the couple of hundred dollars in shipping cost for a return.

Good luck to both of you in resolving this.
 
seems buyer was basically conned. Listing is quite clear that its a one piece back. Buyer should have received a guitar as advertised. I would be very angry in the buyers shoes
 
It wasn't a fair price if the buyer didn't get what he paid for. I think Koiz is risking a lot of business by not resolving this issue.
 
jawilluk said:
It wasn't a fair price if the buyer didn't get what he paid for. I think Koiz is risking a lot of business by not resolving this issue.

Thank you guys, I hope Koiz gets my point.
 
why would anyone buy from koiz after this? v bad form indeed. He's v clearly been caught out.

also seems to be generally symptomatic of japanese sellers at the moment who seem to take no shame in switching parts, covering up defects and misrepresenting pieces they are selling while at the same time time raising prices to take advantage of western buyers.

I have heard of several bad experiences similar to this one recently from guitar friends and the japanese can hide behind the distance to get away with it - what are you going to do realistically if your money is japan to get it back?

Honesty it seems is no longer a japanese virtue - bye bye the code of the samurai!
 
jl1 said:
why would anyone buy from koiz after this? v bad form indeed. He's v clearly been caught out.

also seems to be generally symptomatic of japanese sellers at the moment who seem to take no shame in switching parts, covering up defects and misrepresenting pieces they are selling while at the same time time raising prices to take advantage of western buyers.

I have heard of several bad experiences similar to this one recently from guitar friends and the japanese can hide behind the distance to get away with it - what are you going to do realistically if your money is japan to get it back?

Honesty it seems is no longer a japanese virtue - bye bye the code of the samurai!

Actually I bought a Martin Eric Clapton acoustic from TC Gakki about two years ago, the sales person told me it had original case but when it arrived I got an after market case. Also bad experience shopping oversea.
 
jl1 said:
why would anyone buy from koiz after this? v bad form indeed. He's v clearly been caught out.

also seems to be generally symptomatic of japanese sellers at the moment who seem to take no shame in switching parts, covering up defects and misrepresenting pieces they are selling while at the same time time raising prices to take advantage of western buyers.

I have heard of several bad experiences similar to this one recently from guitar friends and the japanese can hide behind the distance to get away with it - what are you going to do realistically if your money is japan to get it back?

Honesty it seems is no longer a japanese virtue - bye bye the code of the samurai!

I am filing a complain to Paypal, hope that helps.
 
to be honest , thats not so bad. at least the guitar was real.

the stories ive heard include similar to this one with claimed 1 piece bodies that are actually 2-3 piece and it was masked out in the fotos

tokai strats that are claimed as all original and are partscasters (even one that had a non tokai body), switched necks and pickups, paint badly touched in so it doesnt show in the fotos, wrong serial nos etc

buyer beware im afraid is the order of the day
 
Myself... I've had no issues ever with anything I've bought from a Japanese seller..... just bought a couple from Ishibashi exactly as described, great price, fast shipping..... not a problem.

I've talked to Koiz a couple of times on guitars he's had for sale and he knows about guitars - find it hard to believe it was listed as a once piece back - UNLESS he made a mistake in the listing saying that it was a one piece back. If that's the case, then admit it and apologize - no harm in that. Then offer to take back the guitar with full refund OR offer a discount on it. Digging your feet in and hurling insults at an honest buyer who paid in good faith is not going to help matters.
 
marcusnieman said:
Myself... I've had no issues ever with anything I've bought from a Japanese seller..... just bought a couple from Ishibashi exactly as described, great price, fast shipping..... not a problem.

I've talked to Koiz a couple of times on guitars he's had for sale and he knows about guitars - find it hard to believe it was listed as a once piece back - UNLESS he made a mistake in the listing saying that it was a one piece back. If that's the case, then admit it and apologize - no harm in that. Then offer to take back the guitar with full refund OR offer a discount on it. Digging your feet in and hurling insults at an honest buyer who paid in good faith is not going to help matters.

Instead of doing the right thing SAT is posting like mad to regain his territory in this forum.

I am not sure I will purchase from any Japanese dealer on the internet anymore.
 
SAT is digging a hole for himself by posting all over the place.........let him keep digging :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
 
i just dont see the point in the dishonesty

he would have sold it anyway to the right buyer by telling the actual specs anyway so everyone would have been happy , he would have had his profit etc etc

life's too short :evil:
 
Did anyone notice that the buyer did buy direct from Koiz and not through Ebay? Why is he referring to the Ebay add?
 
He contacted him directly and bought the guitar based on the description in the Ebay ad. Since the guitar was already described in the Ebay listing he assumed it would be a 1-piece back as it was listed.

Totally agree with the buyer here, Sat had it for sale with a public listing and it was bought based on that. Bringing the "nationality" of the buyer into it just pulls the whole mess in the wrong direction IMO.
 
yes but unfortunately for the buyer he opted out of the protection that buying through eBay can provide... and now he has no way to get a return/refund other than to harass Sat...
 
I think I read in a previous post he went through Paypal.
I just had the misfortune to buy an "LS 150" through Gumtree and paid through Paypal using "for goods or services".

I knew it wasn't a 150 when it arrived, so filed a dispute. After a few days of not receiving satisfaction from the seller's replies (he did offer a partial refund, but I wanted a total refund) I escalated it to a claim. Had to provide written evidence from a dealer, luthier or other professional accreditation and submit it to the Paypal "judge and jury"!

It took a couple of months but I got all my money and shipping back, but had to return at my own expense.

Whether this can be done internationally ? But not going through Ebay wasn't a problem.
 
wulfman said:
He contacted him directly and bought the guitar based on the description in the Ebay ad. Since the guitar was already described in the Ebay listing he assumed it would be a 1-piece back as it was listed.
It is incorrect to assume that. There were additional representations made in a private discussion that brought about the sale.

I don't know what was said, but it seems that the buyer genuinely thought they were getting a one piece back guitar.

There is some vagueness to this statement by the seller:
"this guitar is center 2 P solid maple and solid moho back".

"solid moho back" does not necessarily mean solid single piece of moho, not in these days of swiss cheese and chambered LPs. You can still have a 2 piece back,
but the unique selling point is that the two pieces are made out of solid pieces of moho.

Is it reasonable to think that a buyer would have missed this very small but important difference? I think it is reasonable, given the existence of the previous description of the guitar,
and that the buyer isn't a guitar dealer (are you?).

On the other hand it's just an example of the sales technique: what I'm not saying is more important than what I am saying.

Seller should cut their losses and accept it back IMO, but if they can work something out between themselves that would be best.
 
wulfman said:
He contacted him directly and bought the guitar based on the description in the Ebay ad. Since the guitar was already described in the Ebay listing he assumed it would be a 1-piece back as it was listed.

Totally agree with the buyer here, Sat had it for sale with a public listing and it was bought based on that. Bringing the "nationality" of the buyer into it just pulls the whole mess in the wrong direction IMO.

Yes, this is the case.
 
I would urge people not to use any dealers and buy direct from yahoo auctions or digimart its easy ... Dealers just inflate prices. A lot of the time as well they buy guitars in poor condition do them up and sell them at a large profit. Buy a beaten up one cheap direct from digimart or yahoo auctions and take it to your local luthier if you dont know how to fix up a guitar
 

Latest posts

Back
Top