Matching body/neck codes misinformation?

Area for Tokai's older than 1985

Moderators: ian, ned

Do body/neck codes have to match?

Yep, to be all original
1
5%
By no means
11
52%
Don?t know
6
29%
Don't care
3
14%
 
Total votes: 21

Reborn Old
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Post by Reborn Old » Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:31 pm

jacco wrote: On the other hand, another fellow forum member and logger Reborn Old, did say earlier this year that after a few years of logging he never had seen a code with a number higher than 15 as second digit and therefore didn't think it was a date code.
To be clear, I've been logging serial numbers only.
My stamp # observation one month ago, was from a quick sample of pics on hand at that moment.
I did obviously find higher numbers shortly afterwards, but my only point was that most numbers from the small sample had low second numbers.
Last edited by Reborn Old on Sun Nov 03, 2013 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Russian Vadim
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Post by Russian Vadim » Sun Nov 03, 2013 7:40 pm

More pics of the supposedly '78 partsocaster

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Peter Mac
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Post by Peter Mac » Sun Nov 03, 2013 8:14 pm

Hi Vadim,

This is by no means an effort to offend you or your friend - just a statement of observations borne of knowledge.

Body : truth be told I am a little shocked. The body looks genuine 1978. All the hallmarks are there for a high-end body, possibly ST-80. The neck pocket grain is ash and the control cavity has no shoulder [required for 11-screw pickguard] Ash is quite porous and tends to soak up the finish, leaving it irregular and not smooth, hence the introduction of alder. The shot of the front pickup cavity clearly shows the finish absorbtion by the grain - alder would not be so violent.

By 1979 all ST and SS bodies, ash or alder, had the cavity shoulder.

My conclusion would still be Partsocaster : St-80 body+electrics with St-50 neck
regards
Peter Mac

PS : Love the socks
The world will not end today...because it is already tomorrow in Australia.

felixcatus
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Post by felixcatus » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:12 am

Another anomaly, two different codes on the same body.

neckpup cavity '11=1'
control cavity '1=7BL A Z'
neck end/heel '2=13A'
and seems like there's 'V' written to the neck pocket

the guitar is:

7okai "Breezysound" TE-80 #01xx
Ash body / Butterscotch blonde
V-profile maple neck,
Deluxe stamped tuners,
FINAL Pro.Spec. stamped vintage bridge / Brass saddles

jacco
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Post by jacco » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:54 am

There are so many.

1981 ST-50
SN 102xxxx
neck: 7 = 4
body: 8 = 5 MR X

felixcatus
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Post by felixcatus » Sun Nov 10, 2013 2:04 am

jacco wrote:There are so many.

1981 ST-50
SN 102xxxx
neck: 7 = 4
body: 8 = 5 MR X
I?m a little confused here, what do you mean by neck, the neck heel, neck pickup cavity or neck pocket?

I refer to the body code only, not the neck heel/body codes.
Only 1 body code in your example, my example has 2 different body codes.

jacco
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Post by jacco » Sun Nov 10, 2013 2:52 am

Neck = neck code to me, otherwise I would say neck pickup cavity code.
Just another contribution to the mismatch pool.

felixcatus
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Post by felixcatus » Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:51 am

jacco wrote:Neck = neck code to me, otherwise I would say neck pickup cavity code.
Same here.
felixcatus wrote: I?m a little confused here, what do you mean by neck, the neck heel, neck pickup cavity or neck pocket?
I asked because your example contains only 2 code series. And I thought you were referring to the example in my previous post, the 2 series of codes on one and the same body.
jacco wrote:There are so many.

1981 ST-50
SN 102xxxx
neck: 7 = 4
body: 8 = 5 MR X
.

jacco
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Post by jacco » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:08 pm

Another contriibution to the no day code & stamp in middel pup cavity;

Image

Image

1978 ST-50

hunter
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Post by hunter » Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:42 am

The ST50N above is my guitar and I have a few questions......
The neck appears original per the codes but there is also the tooling marks in the neck cavity.I have inspected them and there is no evidence of being plugged.If someone were to drill and plug I would think the plug would be flush and not recessed. Also the serial number is pre 8002xxx and is stamped into the cover which I believe Peter said shouldn't be.The 50 stamp is also missing from the last fret??

Image
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jacco
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Post by jacco » Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:48 am

Model type stamp on body = no fretboard stamp. That is normal for 1978.
Normal neck plate = serial number etched on neck plate, small neck plate = serial number stamped on neck. So that's also normal.

hunter
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Post by hunter » Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:52 am

Thanks Jacco...I misunderstood what peter was saying

jacco
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Post by jacco » Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:07 pm

What Peter meant was that up to about 8002000 there's a mix of both small and normal neck plates. After that only the normal neck plate variety.

jacco
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Post by jacco » Thu Nov 28, 2013 5:45 am

Here's an interesting quote from Gottfried (Tokaiguitar.de) on nov 13 2006 on Japanaxe forum:


"any explanations/info with regarding those cavity markings?


These are production schedules: 4 = 3 for example means: The third bulk/ charge of guitars in the month April. In the past I was meaning that would be matching codes. To match and fit the correct neck ino the neck pocket of the body. I met one month ago the president of Tokai. I told him my meaning. He was loughing and said: "Oh no, instead of Fender ... our tool machines were working very correct in the eighties. There were no need to use match codes"

Suki
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Post by Suki » Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:48 am

So this is very interesting info - the codes appear to have a purpose, and in most cases they would match, but because the quality was so consistent, it was not necessary to match codes.

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