Endless topic. But I think there is a right answer here.
Firstly, Gibson USA models are shockingly badly made. I've heard people argue this point, but I don't know how they convince themselves. I've looked at entire walls of new Gibson USA models and found obvious cosmetic flaws on every one. Every. Single. One.
Added to that is their huge divergence from 1950s specs. Who doesn't revere 1950s/1960s Gibsons above others? A tiny minority. And Gibson USA models - chambered, multi-piece backs, heavy tailpieces, etc. - are a long way away. Gibson USA models are often good playing guitars. But their new features and appalling finishing leaves them trailing behind Japanese makers.
So what of Custom Shop historics? Great guitars. And if you compare a 2nd hand one to a new Tokai, they're about the same price - or even cheaper. Just like when you compare a 1980s Jaguar to a new Mazda, guess what? It's cheaper.
I'm not arguing that that's an identical comparison at all, but it's absurd to compare 2nd hand prices to new and say the Gibson is a better deal. Compare the price of a recent 2nd hand historic to a recent 2nd hand premium Tokai, and, once again, the Tokai is significantly cheaper for a guitar that differs only in flavour and emphasis - not quality.
I think it would be truer to say that at $1,850 or so for an R8 you get a **** fine Les Paul that you don't have to justify. No more struggling to explain how your guitar is not an alternative to a Cort or an Epiphone when someone asks you after a gig.
I think that's entirely understandable. But I do think it says more about brand prestige than about guitar quality. There are dud historics and dud premium Tokais - you can't know what the wood's going to do until the guitar's finished and strung up, no matter how good it is on paper.
For me, I think about when pro photographers started pitching up in the 1950s with a little rangefinder camera branded "Nikon." It was obviously a Japanese knock off of the German Leica cameras. Japanese = poor quality toy rubbish. But when people started seeing the results, and realised how much cheaper the Japanese "Leica" was, and heard the owners talking about the quality and reliability, something started to shift.
Electric guitars are not technology driven. They already do what we wish they would do. So Japanese makers aren't going to "trump" Gibson any time soon. But they still offer a fantastically high quality product at a lower price. And like the Japanese camera makers, their respect for their customers is obvious.
In contrast, Gibson makes you pay a lot of money for quality that came standard in the 1950s. At the original price point they offer a product that radiates contempt for their customers - something that is about bean counting and cost saving, not quality.
I would buy a 2nd hand Gibson if it was the right guitar at the right (2nd hand Custom Shop) price. But I'm even more likely to buy the right Tokai, Bacchus, or Burny, since that guitar, 2nd hand, is almost always going to be at a much more tempting price. Gibson USA? I'm totally done with that brand.
