Correct RS Kit Long or Short?

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jackspack

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Which kit should I order, the long or short shaft kit, for my 06 LS150? I gather, having searched, that I will have to enlarge the pot-holes to fit...
Will I need new knobs as well?
Incidentally, how do I get the current knobs off?
Thanks, enjoying a Sat pm tinker ;)
Jack
 
You'll need the short-shaft set.

If the LS150 has metric pots you'll need knew knobs, wedge the old ones off with a teaspoon, using a piece of thick cloth to protect the top of the guitar.

IMO it's a total waste of time and money, your guitar will sound no different after the 'upgrade' even the bottom of the range Japanese Tokais come with high quality pots.

:D
 
Thanks John
I read a lot, then pressed the button on an RS JP Vintage coil tapped/phase kit. With long pots...I did ask, on the order, for them to check I had it right, pot lengths so here's hoping they read it.
:oops:
I accept what you say about the changes, seems to be so many thoughts on this, but will give it a try and see what I think. And post on here my unscientific findings.
J
 
The stock CTS pots that come with the LS150VF MIJ are imperial sized short shaft, so no drilling needed, as the RS CTS Pots fit perfectly in the existing holes. Also, the stock control knobs interchange with the RS Guitarworks pots. I know as I just did the RS upgrade on my 2009 LS150. The only parts that are metric on the LS150 are the tail piece studs their related inserts and the bridge screws which are 4mm. IMO the short shaft pots are just one of the reasons that the LS150 comes closer to the 59-60 LP than the more pricey Tokai's, as they have the long shaft pots which Gibson started in 1977 to install on the LP due to thicker maple top. Here's a photo of my LS150 with RS Guitarworks kit installed with short shaft pots and all braided wire w/vintage sprague tone caps. Cosmetically, this is pretty close to what you'd find in a 50's LP. The early LP's had Centerlabs control pots (no longer available). To easily remove the knobs, use a shoe string wrapped between the guitar body and knob, cross the strings in choking fashion, pull and the knobs should pop off.

P2150180.jpg
 
JohnA said:
IMO it's a total waste of time and money, your guitar will sound no different after the 'upgrade' even the bottom of the range Japanese Tokais come with high quality pots.

:D

Impossible to be sure that his guitar will sound no different.
Also RS have a pot made specifically for them (Superpot) which has a different taper designed for guitar use, so there could be an improvement with that, and RS is the only place you can buy them.
 
JVsearch said:
Impossible to be sure that his guitar will sound no different.

Equally impossible to be sure that it will make the slightest difference to the sound.

Mike
 
JVsearch said:
JohnA said:
IMO it's a total waste of time and money, your guitar will sound no different after the 'upgrade' even the bottom of the range Japanese Tokais come with high quality pots.

:D

Impossible to be sure that his guitar will sound no different.
Also RS have a pot made specifically for them (Superpot) which has a different taper designed for guitar use, so there could be an improvement with that, and RS is the only place you can buy them.

The taper of a pot will make no difference to the sound of a guitar, only where the pot needs to be positioned to get a certain sound might be slightly different.
 
I have done the RS upgrade several times and for these reasons. The stock CTS pots that came in my LS150 (although great) had an average value of 430k not quite the 500k as most would think they'd have and is generally the case with most pots now days in most off the shelf guitars. The RS Guitarworks (CTS) pots are hand picked as well as have a special taper for the volume controls and have averaged 540k with every set I've bought from them, thus averaging 100k or better than stock CTS pots, this translates into more sweep, as well as more resistance, which has an affect not only on volume control and feel but tone as well, and IMO for the better. As you can see from the photo above, I have done more than just change pots, the wiring is now all vintage braided (50's circuit), the ground buss is solid wire and the tone caps are vintage black beauties, the same tone caps as Bumble Bees, just a different color jacket. Making a noticeable difference with guitar tone is generally a collective work IMO. May sound crazy but the nostalgia seems to add to the overall MOJO and helps me play better as well.
 
100K more resistance isn't 100K 'better' it's just different, all pots have a manuafacturing tollerence, and I don't think for one minute 50's Gibson pots will have been hand selected to be closer to 500K than the pots of today, still, if you are happier with the guitar following the mods then who am I to argue :wink: the '50's wiring will have made a noticable change without a doubt, and 'mojo' is definetely not measurable :D

I did a similar job on my LS80, swapped out the Tokai circuit board with little green caps, and put in CTS pots, NOS PIO caps, and nice wire, I'm not so sure it made any difference to the sound of the guitar, but it does look good!
 
Does this 50s wiring have a treble bleed function, like the extra capacitor on a Tele does?
 
Easy Crossing said:
Here's what the 50's wiring circuit looks like.

Thanks, but that's not what I asked. :-? :lol: I assume from the diagram that it does NOT have a treble bleed function? I only ask because LP players seem to discuss 50s wiring all the time, and some comments suggest that it does operate in the same way as a treble bleed circuit does. It's hard, from the various comments I have read, to work out just what the advantage is.
 
stratman323 said:
Easy Crossing said:
Here's what the 50's wiring circuit looks like.

Thanks, but that's not what I asked. :-? :lol: I assume from the diagram that it does NOT have a treble bleed function? I only ask because LP players seem to discuss 50s wiring all the time, and some comments suggest that it does operate in the same way as a treble bleed circuit does. It's hard, from the various comments I have read, to work out just what the advantage is.

It retains treble when rolling down your volume pots, and gives a slightly more open sound when the pots are wide open. Way better than a treble bleed circuit if you believe Jason Lollar (I do) who says a treble bleed mod is more like a bright switch - cuts bass.

See his video about installing Mini-Humbuckers Part 3 from around 3m 30sec:
http://www.lollarguitars.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=mini-humbucker-installation
 
I ask because I find that treble bleed circuits make a Tele virtually unplayable. My TE120 came with one, & I forced myself to live with it for a while. Cutting through that extra capacitor to get rid of it was a great moment - getting rid of the solution to a problem that isn't a problem. :lol:
 
Thanks. I have emailed. Its out of stock, the set with the phase and coil split, so will wait for it to be made. I hope I can wire it all up when it comes. I made a shredmaster clone from that clone stompbox supplier and it almost works sometimes! I haven't ordered the braided wire, just going to unsolder the switch and post, swap them out, and re-solder.
It may be snakeoil, new pots, different capacitors, but life is one go only I am told, so might as well enjoy silliness if thats what it turns out to be. Though I do like the mojo suggestion. Are we sure it cant be measured?
With best
J
 
stratman323 said:
I ask because I find that treble bleed circuits make a Tele virtually unplayable. My TE120 came with one, & I forced myself to live with it for a while. Cutting through that extra capacitor to get rid of it was a great moment - getting rid of the solution to a problem that isn't a problem. :lol:

The most common Tele version of the mod is also IMO the most useless and horrible sounding - just the one 1000pF cap across the volume control.

I use the 50's wiring layout on my tele, though I prefer good treble bleeds on humbuckers. 8)
 

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