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Anonymous
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CoachD said:
A JV made in Mexico?
CoachD said:
Except that the one fact that the otherwise excellent Fender website fails to mention is where the guitar was made.
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A JV made in Mexico?
Except that the one fact that the otherwise excellent Fender website fails to mention is where the guitar was made.
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Anonymous
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Diamond said:You cant compare Tokais poly to let's say fenders poly...Tokais is thinner and just a better job.
The thing I dig most about the Nitro is when you open the case of an LS150 and you get hit by the nitro "smell"...it's cooler than sniffing glue.
I must admit that I've mellowed a bit on the nitro business. It still feels better on the neck to me when playing for an hour or two, but I've got used to the finishes on Goldies & Breezys, & it doesn't bother me the way it used to. And it's true that Tokai's poly is nowhere near as bad as Fender's thick plasticky poly.
Surely most things are cooler than sniffing glue?
stratman323 said:Diamond said:You cant compare Tokais poly to let's say fenders poly...Tokais is thinner and just a better job.
The thing I dig most about the Nitro is when you open the case of an LS150 and you get hit by the nitro "smell"...it's cooler than sniffing glue.
I must admit that I've mellowed a bit on the nitro business. It still feels better on the neck to me when playing for an hour or two, but I've got used to the finishes on Goldies & Breezys, & it doesn't bother me the way it used to. And it's true that Tokai's poly is nowhere near as bad as Fender's thick plasticky poly.
Surely most things are cooler than sniffing glue?
lol, I don't sniff glue, it's unhealthy.
I remember a thread at TGP where John Suhr said he doesn't use nitro because it takes 10 years to dry properly...perhaps he said that because it's more convenient and easier to shoot something else...besides the laws in the USA restricting it's use.
I notice the LS150 has a little sticker that says "Lacquer", not nitro...I'm guessing it's the same thing.
marcusnieman
Well-known member
Diamond said:
There are many different types of lacquer - of which, nitrocellulose was a main component in one of them.
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Anonymous
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Diamond said:
I think there might be something in that theory. Maybe less time if it was played a lot.
marcusnieman
Well-known member
Diamond said:
I think that's baloney. Everything I've heard and read about nitro is that it is VERY fast drying:
http://www.ehow.com/about_5044720_nitrocellulose-lacquer.html
Goestoeleven
Well-known member
I've owned all kinds of Fenders over the years, but i've got to say that Tokais blow them into the weeds.
I think Fender has lost sight now of what made their guitars such an iconic piece of kit, and is just trading on the name now like Gibson have done.
Seeing the Fender controller for "Guitar Hero" was the final straw. I won't be buying any more of their instruments.
I think Fender has lost sight now of what made their guitars such an iconic piece of kit, and is just trading on the name now like Gibson have done.
Seeing the Fender controller for "Guitar Hero" was the final straw. I won't be buying any more of their instruments.
youami
Well-known member
stratman323 said:CoachD said:
A JV made in Mexico?
Jimmie Vaughan sig model I'd say.
marcusnieman
Well-known member
youami said:
+1
leadguitar_323
Well-known member
Nitro celluose is an "evaporative" {if there is such a word} finish, once the "thinner" has evaporated it is dry and this happens very quickly. I can't work out why some guitar manufacturers put Nitro over Poly, whats the use, it only makes the finish thicker defeating the purpose of having a nitro finish in the first place.
Mick
Mick
Diamond said:
Yeah, nitro is the same thing as lacquer - Bacchus dealer told me this.
Does it mean a nitro top coat, with the sealer underneath being poly?
On the Bacchus Duke there is a round sticker saying "Lacquer Finish by Deviser" so I don't know if that indicates an all nitro finish or just the top coat. I'm guessing that it means all nitro on the Duke and the LS-150 because I've also seen acoustic guitars from Headway (another Deviser brand) that describe the finishes as "Top Lacquer" or "All Lacquer" depending on the model, so "Top Lacquer" must mean a nitro top coat only?
Is it the convention among Japanese builders to use the descriptions "Top Lacquer" and "Lacquer Finish" in the way I have suggested? Anybody know for sure? Only asking because it's good to know exactly what you're buying, especially when buying online; I don't care about nitro and poly anymore as long as it is a thin finish.
leadguitar_323 said:
It's used as a sealer on most Fender models from the early 60's onwards, it's very thin and hasn't really hurt the guitars any. It makes it much easier to get a good colour finish on a guitar body, especially if it's ash. The American Vintage Reissues were given the acetone test and only to clear and colour coats were nitro, there was a poly sealer underneath; these are pretty nice guitars btw.
I'm sure lots of other makers do it as well, and it wont make the finish thicker if you were always going to use a sealer, colour and clear coats. Only difference is that the sealer coat is poly.
leadguitar_323
Well-known member
I was referring to Bacchus and Edwards and co who actually put a fairly thick poly clear coat on first. I know how thin poly can be put on, apart from doing heaps of painting myself and using every type of paint known to man, my springy has a poly finish and i can not only see the grain in the wood but i can feel it as well, it is super thin...
Mick
Mick
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Anonymous
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youami said:stratman323 said:CoachD said:
A JV made in Mexico?
Jimmie Vaughan sig model I'd say.
Aha, you mean a JLV Strat? :lol: A JV Strat is something quite different, to me.
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Anonymous
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JVsearch said:
This is where it gets controversial! If you mean Fullerplast, it was a non-nitro sealant coat used from some point in the 60s (I read different things in different places), but I don't think it was anything like the same as the sort of polyester sealant coat used by lots of modern manufactuers. Lets remember that there are different types of "poly", polyurathane (usually used by Tokai) doesn't feel nearly as plasticky as polyester (used on many MIM Fenders, amongst others).
The early 80s (82 to 86) USRIs did not have a poly sealant coat, despite what some people claim. They wouldn't wear like my '83 if they did.
Later models had the poly sealant coat, & these feel very different to me. Personally I have my doubts whether Tokai's nitro over poly is worth the bother. My ES130 is a great guitar, but the finish doesn't feel any different to the finish on my LS85S.
Looks like Edwards LTS 98 or JP LTS 112 is my best option for the price and features I want. Maybe a stray LTS 130 could fit my price range at the right time on ebay.
You've sold me on poly Tokai's though. The photos or real ones do look great that i've seen. If the right LS-90 comes along I wouldn't pass over it because of the finish. I assume the poly finish on some Orvilles would be of similar quality to the Tokai's. Would the same be true for Edwards poly models as well? It's basically the only R4 style BB out there.
I still know next to nothing about Burny's and Greco's.
And yes, JV was intended to mean $400 MIM sig strat not MIJ mid eighties Squier? Btw, do you like Fender Japan's Poly as much as Tokai's? Seems like that the only way to get a 62 custom style tele.
Nitro necks to take a while dry in my opinion. The last two I bought (2004 GT and 2007 AVRI Strat) both seemed to take a while to lose the sticky feel imo. Maybe more than a year. Both feel fine now.
You've sold me on poly Tokai's though. The photos or real ones do look great that i've seen. If the right LS-90 comes along I wouldn't pass over it because of the finish. I assume the poly finish on some Orvilles would be of similar quality to the Tokai's. Would the same be true for Edwards poly models as well? It's basically the only R4 style BB out there.
I still know next to nothing about Burny's and Greco's.
And yes, JV was intended to mean $400 MIM sig strat not MIJ mid eighties Squier? Btw, do you like Fender Japan's Poly as much as Tokai's? Seems like that the only way to get a 62 custom style tele.
Nitro necks to take a while dry in my opinion. The last two I bought (2004 GT and 2007 AVRI Strat) both seemed to take a while to lose the sticky feel imo. Maybe more than a year. Both feel fine now.
Dave_Mc
Well-known member
Diamond said:Hey, don't insult my continent.
Nothing wrong with African mahogany, I have a Tokai SC-2 that's African, it has 'African soul mojo' deep inside of it...at night when I sleep I hear the spirits of the ancestral Zulu warriors coming from the wood...aint no Zulu warriors in Honduras.
i never meant it was inferior, just it's a different wood.
leadguitar_323 said:
my point is that african mahogany isn't "real" mahogany either (if you want to get pedantic).
youami
Well-known member
CoachD said:
You won't get a Greco Les Paul that's less than 10 years old, there's no such thing.
Burny do lots of nice looking Les Pauls (all the different models covered, pretty much), but most of them are made in China:
http://www.fernandes.co.jp/products/burny_guitar.html
Their flametop MIJ is great value for a new MIJ, probably equivalent to a new Tokai LS-95F, but street price is much cheaper. Urethane finish though:
http://www.digimart.net/inst_detail.do?instrument_id=DS00696008
Vintage Grecos and Burnys are where the action is really at, but then you've got a whole other world of learning to do.
Definitely a whole new world of info to get up to speck on Greco's and Burny's. I wouldn't be against a guitar from the 90's. My biggest concern is fret life. I don't want to spend $800-$1000 on an instrument that needs new frets for $300.
