Tokai Buying Advice

GStormcrow · Jul 5, 2005

Hey everyone

First post here. I've been thinking of buying a Gibson Les Paul for a long time now and decided to go ahead and get one from Ishibashi when I noticed the Tokai guitars. Did some research and..... I want a Tokai. Lol I have about 2000 euro for a good tokai and amp. I was looking at both the LS85Q and LS120F. A friend suggested an LC80. What is the better of those 3? I will hopefully be ordering today or tomorrow so any advice, tips, suggestions etc would be really appreciated.

Thanks

benny_j22 · Jul 5, 2005

the ls120f is the better guitar, though it is noticeably more expensive. if u are an accomplished guitar player and can enjoy the differance between varying qualities i suggest this guitar.

i have the tokai ls80f. its a sweet guitar that looks and sounds great. i orderd from japan as well as it is cheaper but i ordered from *guitar universe*. anyways i would suggest you try the guitars before buying them as it is quite mad to buy a guitar you've never played, however if your heart is really set on the tokai just buy the best **** one you can afford!

GStormcrow · Jul 5, 2005

There are 3 tokai's in a guitar shop near me which I will be trying out. If they have that classic les paul sound then I'm happy. I could prob afford an Ls200 but I think the LS120f might be perfect for what I need and I could get a nice amp too

benny_j22 · Jul 5, 2005

tokai are second only to gibson itself when it come to that ''classic'' blues rock sound. in fact you can buy a better 1500? tokai than you can a 1500? gibson!however, a top of the range gibson is unbeatable. i dont know hardly anything about amps but i do know you want a LOUD one so your neighbours can enjoy the sweet sound of your new guitar!

GStormcrow · Jul 5, 2005

Lol cant be too loud. Already had the police down over high levels

ian · Jul 5, 2005

2000Euro is a good deal of money, you could get a very nice Les Paul copy & a good amp for that. If you search carefully you could probably get a used Gibson LP Std or Classic & still enough change for a decent small-ish Combo.

But it really depends what you?re looking for. What will you use the guitar & amp for? Playing out, or playing at home? What sort of tone do you want, any famous examples? How loud do you want/need the amp to be? Amp head + cab, or combo?

If you literally want it tomorrow then that?s too quick for any considered reply... I think you?d likely end up with something 2nd-rate. I?d take a little more time.

Personally I wouldn?t bother with a new guitar ? for 2000Eu I?d look for 1978-79 Tokai Les Paul Reborn or maybe recent used Gibson ? probably a 1980 Marshall Silver Jubilee 2x12 Combo ? I?d take my time & get both via eBay (with care!). :-?

Ian.

GStormcrow · Jul 5, 2005

I've a gig on the 6th of August that I will need the guitar for. I play a lot of classic rock. Queen (Brian May) and Thin Lizzy (Scott Gorham) are big influences but I also play lead for an acoustic singer. Amp would be for home and small/medium size gigs. Preferebly amp head + cab but wouldnt mind a good combo either. I'll have a look around now for that tokai and amp you mentioned. I like the marshall amps a lot and the Vox Ac30

theskywolf · Jul 6, 2005

Hello!

Like Ned said I would go for as used guitar (and amp!). You get more tone and mojo for the money (unless you can't afford a Gibson Hstoric I think, but I've never played one ...) Perhaps you could take one or two weeks looking for that and still be on time for your gig.

Gibson or Tokai - that's a matter of taste. Both make great guitars, Tokais are not that expensive (yet). I have and like both, just a different sound and feel with every guitar.

I'm playing Marshall & Vox as well. As for AC30, I recommend a Korg Reissue (1993-2004), thats's a great amp and still affordable. On ebay one went for under 700 Euros these days (which is a real bargain). Consider a Marshall 18 Watt reissue as this is the greatest tone ever heard, but very expensive (1200 Euros would be a bargain).

Let us know what you do!

GStormcrow · Jul 9, 2005

Just wondering what the general feeling is on this

I've been looking at vintage Tokai's all week. I have narrowed it down a bit. All prices include Irish import tax

1980 Les Paul Reborn Old LS50 w/OHSC ?1260 / ?870 / $1500
1979 Les Paul Reborn LS60 w/OHSC ?1330 / ?916 / $1600
New Love Rock LS120F w/HSC ?1065 / ?734 / $1275

Thoughts please? What do you think I should go for?

ian · Jul 9, 2005

How about this ? it?s already in UK (so no tax, & minimal delivery costs), 5 hours left on the auction & its now ?620 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=38086&item=7334128206&rd=1.

Ian.

theskywolf · Jul 9, 2005

How much is the Irish import tax? If it's the same as it is in germany, tax & customs make about 20% of the price and shipping costs. Assuming this, the Les Paul reborns will be over 1000 EUR each (without customs/tax, incl. shipping?). That's not a real bargain, but it's not an unrealistic price right now.

I just payed around 750 EUR / 500 GBP for a 1980 LS 60 Reborn Old here in germany (so no tax/customs). If I would have bought this for the same price in Japan, it would have cost me around 1000 EUR incl. all.

Do you care about collector's value and the name on the headstock or do you want a player? The early (80/81) Love Rocks are the same guitars as the "Reborn Old", but they are cheaper than Reborn Olds and even more cheaper than "Les Paul Reborn".

Wolf

GStormcrow · Jul 9, 2005

Irish tax is 21% so about ?200 on a ?1000 guitar. Also its usually ?100-140 shipping as well

GStormcrow · Jul 9, 2005

I'm a bit wary about buying any Gibson online without playing. More so than a Tokai. It's just with the history behind Gibsons quality control I'd rather go for a Tokai. I think it might be the safer option considering I'm buying without trying it out first. Name doesnt bother me. I want the best sound. I got the impression though that the early 79 Reborns are as close to the best Les Paul sound you can get which is ultimately what I am after

hans-j?rgen · Jul 9, 2005

GStormcrow said:
1980 Les Paul Reborn Old LS50 w/OHSC ?1260 / ?870 / $1500
1979 Les Paul Reborn LS60 w/OHSC ?1330 / ?916 / $1600
New Love Rock LS120F w/HSC ?1065 / ?734 / $1275

Thoughts please? What do you think I should go for?

I don't know what you should go for, but I would probably choose the LS 120. :wink:

GStormcrow · Jul 9, 2005

It looks I can get a 1979 Les Paul Reborn LS80 w/OHSC and delivery for a total of either ?1150 or ?1200 at most

Does that sound any better? Very tempted at this because shipping from Japan costs about 140euro and import tax would be about 200euro. On the LS80 I wont be paying import tax and shipping is included at that price

QuattroSte · Jul 11, 2005

GStormcrow,

Where are you in Ireland? Have you play Tokai before?

theskywolf · Jul 11, 2005

A LS 80 Les Paum reborn for that price including all is a good deal, if the guitar is in good & original condition. I would really think about it, but it's your decision! And then you just have to play it and see if it fits!

ian · Jul 11, 2005

If you have to pay VAT at 17.5% then 1100Eu adds up to ?760 + ?133 tax. That?s very near the price of a new Gibson LP Classic or LP Standard.

Despite Gibson?s poor reputation on QC (mostly small niggles), & despite my love for old Tokais, I have to say that some of the best guitars I?ve ever played were Gibson?s, for both tone & feel.

Remember that a 26 year old Reborn may need more money spent fixing fret problems etc. Also, internet sales rarely offer any opportunity to try the guitar before buying, nor any guarantee if it?s bad.

If you were talking of maybe ?600 ($1000) then it?s Tokai, no contest. But if you?re up around ?1000 ($1750) then Gibson has to be taken seriously imho.

If you search hard enough you will almost certainly find a 1970?s Gibson LP Deluxe or 1980-ish pre-Historic LP-Standard with great tone & feel at an affordable price ? I?d think seriously about that. Just my 2:cents of course :-? .

Ian.

GStormcrow · Jul 11, 2005

Ok lets see. Quattro I am in Dublin (Clondalkin Village). I have tried a tokai in Musician Inc in Dublin city. Was very impressed. I have asked a seller in Germany to hold a 79 Ls80 Reborn in great condition for me. ?1200 including insured delivery, original tokai hard case and he said if I dont like it or am not happy then he will glady refund my money. So considering shipping from Japan costs 120euro I think I am getting a good deal for ?825 including delivery (guitar works out at about ?750) and a return policy. I deffinitely wont have to pay any import taxes or charges either which is great whereas if I buy from outside the EU then I would have to pay a lot more in taxes and import duties. Here are some pictures of the guitar

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y160/Darren_Kenny/Totoltop.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y160/Darren_Kenny/HeadstockBody.jpg

I'll post up some further info when I get it. So what do you think? Good guitar at a good deal?

ian · Jul 11, 2005

I don?t know how it works in Ireland, but if I import from Germany to UK then I?m exempt from Import Duty/Tax, but that?s only 3.5% anyway. However, afaik I still get charged 17.5% for VAT & that?s charged on full cost inc. shipping. If it?s all working OK then 79 LS80 Reborn should certainly be a lovely guitar (ask seller about plastic parts, ie switch tip & ring, scratch plate) ? ?800+ is quite a lot of money for a guitar, but you know all that stuff (did I mention Gibson?,? ha, don?t answer that lol). :-?

Ian.

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